Archery

[Soupy]

Get rid of the crosshair. This is the first progress toward a good system. I don't need to know when my shot is fully drawn with the crosshair because there's a whole animation to let me know that. The crosshair does nothing. It blocks the view of my shot as well as the arrow trail, ESPECIALLY at long distances. Just trash the crosshair and use the ACTUAL tip of the arrow to line up shots, please and thank you.

 

[Ori]

Very much like the dot / crosshair.

The animation does not line up with where you are shooting though (and by that I mean the line of the arrow shaft aims to the left of the screen but the arrow goes magically straight somehow, totally fine with the crosshair being above the arrow head slightly, looks good), that is a little disturbing.

 

[Valoran]

I couldn't agree more with this. We have everything we need conveyed to us already through the visible bow and animation, the reticle and circle is redundant, provided they change the point of aim to not be so high above the arrow tip as it is right now.


Hopefully we see some changes to this soon.

 

[Vagrant]

I agree for the most part except I don't mind the current physics relative to the tip either, I'd just rather not have any 'aim-assist' at all and adapt organically with practice.
edit - I am landing a lot of long shots pretty easily at present, it doesn't feel like much of a learning/practice curve at this point.

 

[JimLit]

keep the cross hair. archery will undoubtedly be underpowered, why make it any harder than it needs to be?

 

[Kaemik]

keep the cross hair. archery will undoubtedly be underpowered, why make it any harder than it needs to be?

I don't necessarily agree. I believe we're still missing three of the primaries archery will eventually have. And that's 300 out of 400. Archer is a 400 point line if you fully spec every primary last time I checked. Also, Alvarins get a bonus to move speed and archery so we're likely to see most foot archers get a bit better at kiting come release. The bows that are in now we don't know what they are. If they're the best that can possibly made they do seem a bit weak but perhaps they're only midtier or slightly above midtier.

Finally, mages in MO1 have a cast time they must stand still for. I think this is where archers are really going to shine if that mechanic carries over. Mages are going to be wearing lighter armor for increased mana regen usually so if they stop to cast a spell that is the perfect opportunity for more mobile archers to slaughter them. It's going to be very difficult for a mage to beat an archer in a ranged fight if most spells retain their cast timers.

So the problem may not be that archery is underpowered as much as that they are missing half their features and the build they are supposed to counter hasn't made it in-game yet.

All that being said. When I first joined archery didn't feel GREAT but it felt good. The last few times I used it, it felt awful. I feel like they tweaked something and it broke. Anyone else feel that way?

 

[Necromantic]

Finally, mages in MO1 have a cast time they must stand still for. I think this is where archers are really going to shine if that mechanic carries over. Mages are going to be wearing lighter armor for increased mana regen usually so if they stop to cast a spell that is the perfect opportunity for more mobile archers to slaughter them. It's going to be very difficult for a mage to beat an archer in a ranged fight if most spells retain their cast timers.

That is mostly only true for Ecumenical magic, and few other schools, while on foot.

 

[Vagrant]

All that being said. When I first joined archery didn't feel GREAT but it felt good. The last few times I used it, it felt awful. I feel like they tweaked something and it broke. Anyone else feel that way?

yes it changed last patch, it was kind of like MO archery where you use the arrow tip, now the trajectory physics have changed a bit, you see a puff of dust or a bit of a tracer sometimes to assist correction but it's more based on practicing your ranged shots and less about crosshairs etc - whatever it is something changed for sure, was mentioned in patch notes too.

I'm landing some long head shots on Springboks for around 78-81, other shots land around 60-70 on body/limbs so far, I don't find the crosshair reticle stuff to be much use once you've practiced a bit and would personally prefer no assist as it distracts from getting used to getting a natural feel for it.

 

[Kaemik]

Ah so it feels bad because it was working one way then changed to another. I suppose when the next patch hits I'll play around with it more. Definitely doesn't feel like they're done tweaking it yet though so I'll hold off on doing too much with it until then.

 

[ChonoKhan]

I don't care about the crosshair tbh... but the animations for shooting are annoying. After every shot, my animation gets stuck before I can nock another arrow...

 

[Vakirauta]

Shooting in MO1 without crosshair was a nice thing, I would like it to stay that way in this game

 

[Kaemik]

Yeah if the crosshair isn't going to help me tell where the arrow is going but actually throw off my shot if I try to use it then I'm sure that's something they'll be fixing. That's why I thought the recently patched archery system felt "awful" because I was aiming the intuitive way one assumes they should aim with a crosshair on their screen. Keeping it in will only confuse newbs and distract vets.

 

[Ask]

I don't agree with taking it away, but I think you should be given the option to have it or not. The only thing removing it will do is improve immersion. So why not let those who want that have it. /shrug

 

[Vagrant]

The only thing removing it will do is improve immersion

awesome

have you tried it out with range and accuracy ? it's kind of shit lol

 

[Ask]

awesome

have you tried it out with range and accuracy ? it's kind of shit lol

It is but I don't think its any better than the old system, half my time in MO1(7 years) was spent on the back of a mount farming via mounted archery. Sometimes your character model would move the tip of the arrow yet it would always fly in the direction it was pointing before the movement of the model. Hence why I say the only thing removing the crosshair will do is improve immersion because I simply dislike both.

 

[Vagrant]

It is but I don't think its any better than the old system, half my time in MO1(7 years) was spent on the back of a mount farming via mounted archery. Sometimes your character model would move the tip of the arrow yet it would always fly in the direction it was pointing before the movement of the model. Hence why I say the only thing removing the crosshair will do is improve immersion because I simply dislike both.

yep I've also used the old MO system through it's many buffs and nerfs since about 2011, probably not half the time though, i do agree with you on all counts, i just get the impression so far that crosshairs and reticles only serve to confuse so why not go for immersion.

I do wonder how it will go once we're on mounts again with movement,
I also wonder if the current archery system represents the *best* accuracy and damage we can expect at persistence too ?

 

[Ask]

yep I've also used the old MO system through it's many buffs and nerfs since about 2011, probably not half the time though, i do agree with you on all counts, i just get the impression so far that crosshairs and reticles only serve to confuse so why not go for immersion.

I do wonder how it will go once we're on mounts again with movement,
I also wonder if the current archery system represents the *best* accuracy and damage we can expect at persistence too ?

Well thankfully we still have a few more months. My last bit of logic I can muster without actually doing further tests is if it is inaccurate. how much so, how far does the arrow land from the crosshair. Is it to the right or the left. Above or below. I feel that would be easier to adjust for than the tip of an arrow that moves constantly if held during periods of animation drift. Although not getting persistent at the end of the year upsets me greatly. Its things like this its in the best interest for I guess. So credit to the OP for bringing it up.

 

[Kaemik]

If the arrow tip isn't accurate, and the crosshair isn't accurate, perhaps we need an aiming reticle that is accurate? Something like a large circle if that is what the arrow is going to fall within or a fall-off reticle as bows have in some games. And if nothing is predictive of where the arrow will go within the current system then they need to keep tweaking it until something is.

It's a bit non-immersive but an arrow tip that doesn't work is too. We have a small crosshair with arrows for melee. Giving us the information we need to play our characters is more immersive than a system with no GUI that presents more challenges than we actually face doing the same task IRL. And I've shot in archery tournaments IRL in the "barebow" category (on an unsighted bow). XD

 

[Ori]

The crosshair I suspect is there mostly for the charge and flash for max damage so there is consistency within the combat system.

It shows you where the arrow will hit with a high% of accuracy until it has passed a certain distance where you will need to start to adjust, which isn't any different than how you would play without the crosshair. This isn't something that new players won't understand or won't be able to figure out in a short amount of time.

Make it optional if needed, I don't see any reason to argue against that besides wanting to try and punish other players. Biggest problem with archery is the messed up animation directions. Was the same with MO1, it's like the person doing the modeling does not understand perspective!

 

[bbihah]

Crosshair will need to stay to some extent until they;
A) Have a consistent aiming mechanic using something as a reference point for aiming. A couple weeks ago the aiming was horrible when the shots did not line up with anything(not crosshair, not tip of arrow, NOTHING made sense. We do not want that again. There needs to be at least a reference point for where the arrows leaves your bow.

B) Visual AND audio feedback telling you how far back you are drawn for timing the release of your shots to have a consistent experience with aiming your shots. The sound of the bow pulling back should line up with some sort of animation that lets you know that the bow is fully drawn back and let you know when after its fully drawn back that you are getting your maximum range and damage. The limbs of the bow having a slight shake, vision zooming in just a slight bit, something visual like that on top of the entire audiovisual aesthetic around drawing the bow would let you know the status of your draw.


Until then, the crosshair will have to stay.