Rep still doesn't go far enough.

[Tashka]

Yes this way you are not gonna get banned from the city you live in cuz you killed a your enemies or random RPKers.

That's the only positive i see. But with forced wardecs, i won't be banned too.

You cant make a mistake with criminal actions off. This is the intention that you cant go "red" without intending to do so. Keeping players from being pushed into the RPK play style.

Of course i'll turn crim actions off. Fighting near guards isn't the brightest of ideas anyway.

Fighting in town? Dont think any law enforcement would allow that. Very bad for business.

Yet it happens all the time in real towns. Happened even more often before cameras, face recognition, DNA analisys etc

Faction v Faction is already announced for MO2 just wasnt cleared up how it would work.

Well that's sad news.

You can still do it and no way to change that either way,but this would limit the reasons for it.

No it won't. I won't be able to enter blue towns where all the stables and extraction tools are, and MK backdrop as well, so that's the reason enough to P2W.

 

[Emdash]

- everyone local grey with no consequences for murder means wilderness is a deathmatch, much like albion black zones
- make one mistake and you're locked out of town for good
- no forced wardecs, we get artificial FvF that has no place in sandbox games like this one. I never had problems with guilds in Tindrem, my enemies are right here in Morin Khur.
- still doesn't solve the problem of the system being easily gamed by having an alt account

who cares about alt accts, and it won't become death matches because people group. Grouping is a big thing in MO. I assume it is also in albi, but this fantasy that the world is going to become HELL if they make most people local grey (people who choose to actually pvp at any time, who aren't innocent bystanders), why should you be able to pvp at some times and not others, why should it depend on forcing a wardec or not, again, it's based on WHEN YOU ARE READY. Once people see what happens and how nobody is able to do anything if you just KoS everyone then they will develop a society. It will be like going thru human history except with immortality and brains that have historical insight. I know if you kill me, and kill another guy, I'm going to go to the other guy and say... hey let's go kill this guy, he's annoying. Not only will we be on better terms after we kill you, but you have the option to either back off or recruit someone to help you, in the end, it actually develops into something advanced and sandboxy. If it ever goes off the rails and gets too toxic, devs can intervene, but you would be surprised. I mean if you look at MO1 and everyone building walled camps, all-time pvp is not what anyone wants, despite what they say. Being able to opt in or opt out of pvp, catch people sleeping and then hide behind your flag or rep, is a design flaw. 1 MC isn't the same to everyone, nor is 1 rep.

But I do agree that I don't like what I heard of said system, and I'm slightly suspect of a doc written by ID and RPK. It SEEMS like 'the good guys and the bad guys' working together, but we all know that's hype. HYPE.

Forced town wardecs suck and I've only experienced them leading to town griefing, opposed to really good fights. You are sitting there and like 10 people roll into town and start slaughtering and camping everyone. It's like ok that's fun. I'm trying to walk to the market place and stay out of the way of people mobbing crafters.

Explain why forced wardecs are not the same as everyone who pvps being local grey? Excepting that you choose your target. You choose a target you believe you can beat. You calculate. Where as in the instance where everyone can fight, you have to deal with all sorts of mish-mashes of players working together to achieve a goal. Whether it's like let's hold down GK for the day and get some blasting done or w/e... just because some people are too pea brained to succeed and believe they need to kill everyone in sight and that it won't actually end up limiting them, I don't think that's a compelling argument. Like I said I haven't played albion, def seen the game play. I dunno if it's much like Mortal at all in terms of scope of the map and resources, though. And you're always 'safe' in town.

Edit: @ fight or flight, I've been talking to people since MO1. You would be surprised how well it works. I feel bad for people who are instantly fleeing everyone they see. If they start running at you, and you kite them around a bit... and then type like why, you might be surprised. You can talk from far enough away to be safe haha. But if someone wants to draw first blood v me, that's cool. I know I can spawn and I'll remember them next time. I'd rather take the chance of making a friend and die than run away like a bitch or kill someone who might not have been my enemy. You should try it. It def does depend on typing skill and it's harder to do when I have my kb in 'playing position' opposed to typing position, but still. I mean you can tell, imo, all you need to do is say sup and you can tell by how they wiggle... haha I mean IMO at least, you can read these dudes minds. You def gotta be ready to quick draw, but in most cases the advantage people get is minimal w/ how much dmg you can absorb. Nobody is gonna win a fight off that first hit they get while you are typing sup, and if they just come in on you, you even have time to type why while you are drawing your wep. VoIP would make it even easier, but voip in mo nah...

I spend more time telling people to slow down that I'm not doing anything than I got fights, but I legit was close to or over 50% at 'fights avoided' in MO1 (not counting people who instantly flee, people who I Stand face to face with), and that's pretty good imo, if you want to interact and not fight. And the people who are gonna fight everyone become known really fast.

 

[Tashka]

who cares about alt accts, and it won't become death matches because people group. Grouping is a big thing in MO. I assume it is also in albi, but this fantasy that the world is going to become HELL if they make most people local grey (people who choose to actually pvp at any time, who aren't innocent bystanders), why should you be able to pvp at some times and not others, why should it depend on forcing a wardec or not, again, it's based on WHEN YOU ARE READY. Once people see what happens and how nobody is able to do anything if you just KoS everyone then they will develop a society. It will be like going thru human history except with immortality and brains that have historical insight. I know if you kill me, and kill another guy, I'm going to go to the other guy and say... hey let's go kill this guy, he's annoying. Not only will we be on better terms after we kill you, but you have the option to either back off or recruit someone to help you, in the end, it actually develops into something advanced and sandboxy. If it ever goes off the rails and gets too toxic, devs can intervene, but you would be surprised. I mean if you look at MO1 and everyone building walled camps, all-time pvp is not what anyone wants, despite what they say. Being able to opt in or opt out of pvp, catch people sleeping and then hide behind your flag or rep, is a design flaw. 1 MC isn't the same to everyone, nor is 1 rep.

I get what you're trying to say but it's not real life and it never worked so well in MMORPGs. People will just KOS everyone they see, naked or not, because they no longer need to think about whether or not it's worth the rep loss. So we get a completely free safezones where you can't kill anyone on one side, and deathmatch wilderness on the other. It's leads to a really shitty game dynamics that somehow works in Eve, but Eve is a special snowflake that got a lot of things working that don't work so well in other games that tried to copy them.

Forced town wardecs suck and I've only experienced them leading to town griefing, opposed to really good fights. You are sitting there and like 10 people roll into town and start slaughtering and camping everyone. It's like ok that's fun. I'm trying to walk to the market place and stay out of the way of people mobbing crafters.

It doesn't have to be town wardecs though. I remember someone proposed it this way - a guild that's being wardecced can CHOOSE to make it a town war or not. This, and maybe some additional mechanics (like limited wardec slots etc) would be enough to stop guilds from just wardeccing everyone.

Explain why forced wardecs are not the same as everyone who pvps being local grey?

With limited wardec slots, wardec costs, or a system described above a guild will have to decide whether or not wardeccing is worth it even if they are as strong or even stronger than the other guild. Just like how you need to decide whether killing a naked newbie that you can certainly beat is worth it right now. Yes you can wardec a 5 man guild being a 50-men zerg. But it costs you a wardec slot, maybe some gold, and maybe the target may choose to make it a town war, and it's not like you'll gain much from wardeccing them, will you do that or not? See how "being able to beat" is not the only deciding factor here?

Edit: @ fight or flight, I've been talking to people since MO1. You would be surprised how well it works.

I didn't play MO1 but i'm under the impression that you'd be getting murder counts and at some point you'd start suffering stat loss after respawning anywhere but your keep. To be honest it sounds like a much better system than the one we have now. As long as there are slums/unguarded zones in towns that criminals can enter.

Plus, not everyone is good in english. Some of my guildmates need help translating "riding" or "magic schools". Don't think they could talk their way out of a bad situation.

 

[Emdash]

It doesn't have to be town wardecs though. I remember someone proposed it this way - a guild that's being wardecced can CHOOSE to make it a town war or not. This, and maybe some additional mechanics (like limited wardec slots etc) would be enough to stop guilds from just wardeccing everyone.

someone called me someone, once.

But I honestly believe... I mean I am legit insane LOL, most people have not heard me like 'in action', just monotone vidz if I do speak, but I believe 100% it would work in MO in the same way it works in Eve. There's too much to gain. There would still be a lot of pvp, but it wouldn't be a total shitshow. I think it would be good to start there and move outward, but that's just me.

I'm not even a hardcore pvper, and we knowww this. I just want people to have the right tools to make the game 'actually work.' MO has more sandbox potential than EvE imo because of the first person action part. Sure, Eve is probably more balanced (assuming?) cuz w/ such graphics comes wonk, but in terms of politics, I feel like MO is probably closer to Eve than it is to the other games that 'it didn't work.'

And like I said, you can choose to flag non combat and thus if you get killed you are actually murdered. You can even start out that way, but then once you choose to flag open pvp, can't go back. So people who just wanna play the game can play the game, people who get off on murder can murder and be punished, the rest of us can PvP when necessary.

Edit: @ talking yea... in general communication and how you present yourself does matter, but it can be learned. Nobody gave a shit about murder counts in MO1 looool. Most people at least. It was still KILLYA IF I SEE YA. But if you run you just make yourself suspicious, like you have something good on you, inspires predatory instinct. Man MO1 was really bad but really good... lol MO1 was good enough to bring ALL of us who played MO in various eras for various lengths of time back here, some who don't even have plans to play MO2, and troll the forums. I was so disappoint at SV when they had that hack happen, but as soon as I got the e-mail about MO2... I was like wat... mo2? It happened?? Oh shit...! Then I spent a few months like yea Mo2... coming out but no way I'm playing that shit... and then you know. lol. It's really a special game man. Like I said, so bad... so good. This game is trying a bit too hard, I think. It's trying to fix problems that can't be fixed and ignoring ones that can, IMO, again.

 

[Tashka]

And like I said, you can choose to flag non combat and thus if you get killed you are actually murdered. You can even start out that way, but then once you choose to flag open pvp, can't go back.

That's one step to complete opt-out. And i don't trust SV enough to think they'll never take the last step if the population drops and people begin demanding opt-out system on forums. And i believe rules should be the same for everyone (a bit different for criminals but it's consequence for their actions, not something they can just opt-in to or opt-out from) if the game advertises it as the most immersive MMORPG.

 

[Albanjo Dravae]

I'm not trying to come off as a self proclaimed "leet peeveepee" player. But I've played in a lot of guilds with really skilled players, and I find I'm also a pretty skilled player generally speaking.

More often then not, higher skilled players typically kill everyone due to a habit instilled in them from MO1.

Right now players have no way to 'rob' others, or to take loot without killing. Some would argue this kind of mechanic is stupid and you should have to KILL someone say they are punished for wanting their items. But I say fuck that.

You shouldn't be able to FORCEFULLY rob someone, the player should have a toggle where he temporarily 'surrenders' and his loot is available to be taken.

The second reason higher skilled players kill everyone is because in reality they're not highly skilled and suck ass and can't manage a real fight with players that would absolutely slam their heads in.

Thank you for coming to a [CTX] Casually Toxic TED talk.

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[CTX] Casually Toxic Mercenary Services

[CTX] Casually Toxic is a NA PvP guild looking to offer its services in exchange for currency, resources, or other forms of payment in exchange for our time and effort. Below we will detail our available contracts. Prices will always be negotiable and therefore set prices will not be provided...

mortalonline2.com

theres /droploot incase you didn't knew.

 

[LordMega]

More often then not, higher skilled players typically kill everyone due to a habit instilled in them from MO1.

Right now players have no way to 'rob' others, or to take loot without killing. Some would argue this kind of mechanic is stupid and you should have to KILL someone say they are punished for wanting their items. But I say fuck that.

You shouldn't be able to FORCEFULLY rob someone, the player should have a toggle where he temporarily 'surrenders' and his loot is available to be taken.

But this game will have thievery, as MO1 did. And that's exactly what you'd be doing, forcibly robbing players who might not even have any idea that their inventory has suddenly sprung quite a leak. So I could just keep a thief in my PK party and do the same thing to my victims anyways. Mercy them, have my thief pick them clean, and ride off freely.

 

[Jatix]

After that, just join a guild or start one this is no solo game.

Reason #1000 that MO2 wont succeed. The most successful thing runescape ever did, was make a game mode you can pick, that makes it so you cant trade and have to do everything solo. with multiple variations of this game mode. they have also added many solo bosses. Solo play, is popular. Most people cant get all their friends to play the same game with them.

I'm not saying they should make MO a solo only game. but people saying its not a solo game just means its going to flop. Most players are solo, and when they hear the only way to succeed is to join a group that probobly is annoying to be in (very guild I've ever joined), they are going to quit.

 

[Tashka]

Reason #1000 that MO2 wont succeed. The most successful thing runescape ever did, was make a game mode you can pick, that makes it so you cant trade and have to do everything solo. with multiple variations of this game mode. they have also added many solo bosses. Solo play, is popular. Most people cant get all their friends to play the same game with them.

I'm not saying they should make MO a solo only game. but people saying its not a solo game just means its going to flop. Most players are solo, and when they hear the only way to succeed is to join a group that probobly is annoying to be in (very guild I've ever joined), they are going to quit.

It depends on population density really. Beta was perfectly soloable, and i think it can still be with x5 players. Solo doesn't necessarily mean "can't talk to people ingame and make friends here".

But as much as i agree with you that there should be a place for solo players, MO2 doesn't have to be the next runescape to succeed.

 

[Emdash]

That's one step to complete opt-out. And i don't trust SV enough to think they'll never take the last step if the population drops and people begin demanding opt-out system on forums. And i believe rules should be the same for everyone (a bit different for criminals but it's consequence for their actions, not something they can just opt-in to or opt-out from) if the game advertises it as the most immersive MMORPG.

Disagree hard. It's not opt out. You're opting out of being able to, as I said, push players, loot players, pvp AT ALL. In turn you are gaining 'actual innocence' that cannot be argued. You might be an alt, but you're still an innocent. Griefing people's alts is a bit funny. THEN you will be 'murdered.' The people who want to just play the game and not pvp can do that. There is def a portion and by letting everyone else be local grey with no penalties, it will make murdering for people who WANT TO MURDER or SEE A CHANCE AT LOOT THEY CAN'T PASS UP, basically a risk. Everything else is pvp. The reason why once you flag yourself open to pvp that you should not be able to flag back is because you are no longer innocent. There might be a system implemented on top of that, but you cannot claim innocence if you have participated in any form of pvp, looted someone, whatever. It's up to interpretation, basically, by something on the level of 'a jury of your peers', but how likely is that going to happen? No GAME SYSTEM is going to truly be able to distinguish true innocence from someone using a blueflag. I mean, given the complexity of the game, it's just lacking. There should be a system to distinguish people who are on pvp open characters who are not actively pvping (once you fix all this, war decs become almost unnecessary,) maybe a slight penalty for going in on them, but when Henrik says INNOCENT that's some get out of here level stuff if you equate blue flag with innocent. You also need open PVP zones. There is NO REASON WHY MO DOES NOT HAVE THESE THINGS. At the very least you should be able to put up towers and make your territory open pvp.

My boy Tzone is always talking about rep grief on BDO, but it's like he wasn't playing on ARSHA (the no penalty pvp server.) It was eye opening to me how much better the gameplay was there. Some people might come thru and steam roll you, but you could usually go back to farming. The sweaties had a chance to constantly fight for the high end spots. I didn't even p2w on BDO (did spend like 100 tho, hehhh), and I was like at the very lowest end of gear, and I was still loving arsha, even taking deaths it was fun. And like I said you'd pick up people at the spawn spot. I was a ranger and everyone wanted a pocket ranger. There were v few people who were so geared I could not hurt them even tho my gear was nowhere near what a lot of the people had. All I needed was a class who could put someone on their back to drop them and we could secure the kill. Or you know, you run into the 10k club people who were just jokingly untouchable, but MO is not like that...

The level of resources and the map size means that yea there would be more pvp, but if you give people a chance to be 'innocent' until they are ready to actually pvp... like let them have an arena or something they can pvp in to practice, or do duels. Then yea, throw the harsh consequences at people who PK them because there is no reason to when there is so much pvp elsewhere.

I say start from that then work outward. But like I said I have crazy ideas. One thing I've learned tho... my ideas really can work. A lot of people oppose them because they sound wild, but when you really think about it, it seems a lot closer to what MO is TRYING to do than what they have now.

Reason #1000 that MO2 wont succeed. The most successful thing runescape ever did, was make a game mode you can pick, that makes it so you cant trade and have to do everything solo. with multiple variations of this game mode. they have also added many solo bosses. Solo play, is popular. Most people cant get all their friends to play the same game with them.

I'm not saying they should make MO a solo only game. but people saying its not a solo game just means its going to flop. Most players are solo, and when they hear the only way to succeed is to join a group that probobly is annoying to be in (very guild I've ever joined), they are going to quit.

also join ETERNAL. You're just the kind of person we want! All I can promise you is a month of fun, tho, ahaha. I dunno if I'm gonna stay on, either, the way things look.