Mounted combat nerfs

[Kebek]

Ah yes. Just get a hammer! Duh. I shall never leave home without it!

And the "they invested more gear" argument is so bad. MC isn't just popular because its relatively new.

There are many reasons listed in this thread. You just don't like them or can't read.


My experience is completely different than yours. Nice attempt at trying to be an oracle though, I guess.

I named you the reasons why it isn't an issue. Your feelings just don't want to see the facts.

You have the option to bring a hammer but choose not to. It's not an issue, just a consequence of the choices you make.

"The they invested more gear argument is so bad" yet you offer no rebuttal. Are you also going to whine about people with steel words doing more damage than people with bone tissue swords?


Everything I said is backed up by decades of scientific studies. Tread carefully or you may find yourself on the blocked list, champ.

 

[MolagAmur]

I named you the reasons why it isn't an issue. Your feelings just don't want to see the facts.

You have the option to bring a hammer but choose not to. It's not an issue, just a consequence of the choices you make.

"The they invested more gear argument is so bad" yet you offer no rebuttal. Are you also going to whine about people with steel words doing more damage than people with bone tissue swords?


Everything I said is backed up by decades of scientific studies. Tread carefully or you may find yourself on the blocked list, champ.

I've offered a rebuttal plenty of times in the past. I honestly don't know why I post on these threads. Its always just arguing with someone else with a different perspective than you whose unable to change it. I lose braincells every time.

Do everyone a favor and block us all.


champ

 

[Kebek]

I've offered a rebuttal plenty of times in the past. I honestly don't know why I post on these threads. Its always just arguing with someone else with a different perspective than you whose unable to change it. I lose braincells every time.

Do everyone a favor and block us all.


champ

I'm sorry. Did calling you champ hurt you?

You seem to take this way too personal. Perhaps a break is in order.

Anyway, for those of us who actually want to discuss the topic rather than derail it completely cause of personal issues, mounted combat isn't an issue. Group fights are still mainly fought by foot fighters despite MC being popular right now cause of novelty. This didn't turn into "horse rider online".

Whoever claims mounted combat took over is playing a different game.

 

[Lawolf]

The one thing that always annoyed me is that whole footfighter elitism that is floating around in this community.
Apparently its the only class where you can prove your skill. If you play Mage or Mounted youre just a noob who likes clicking one button.

What if I actually enjoy those playstyles and dislike footfighting because of the whole beyblade stuff and constant cirklejerking?

Well anyways I just wanted to get this one out of the way real quick.

Imo MC definetly does need some work. I defiently disagree with it being OP before horse armor... a longbowman could 3 shot your horse easily from a mile away which was just dumb. I do however agree that the values on horse armor are a bit skewed since they can reach player armor levels without a big downside. Its mainly the stam management that goes to hell but that only really matters against other mounteds anyways.

Even master snipers only deal around 45damage against my molarium guard fur horse while I only lost like 10% momentum.

I also dislike how one dimensional MCs are since swinging weapons is hard as fudge while couching just deals more damage and is easier. Swinging doesnt even get the same momentum treatment for some reason (2 trot and 3 trot damage are the same when using swings unless they changed it this patch).



Currently alot of footies love running around with their duel meta weapons and dont bother using Mauls and Axes which can both dismount well enough and keep complaining about how you cant dismount MCs. I do agree that there needs to be more since picking up balance eliminates Axes for the most part but complaining without having tried those weapons and doing some practice is dumb. Ive rode into tons of spear/sword wielding footies because no one wants to use blunt weapons so there is no reason to be scared at all. If atleast 2 of those used maces and are as good as they claim they could easily dismount me.

Its just important that the dismounting actually fucks the rider hard which isnt the case currently.

I also agree that magery is way too easy to splash into mounted builds because of the lack of DEX investment needed which gives them unnatural sustain. I literally made a character with 121INT and enough STR to wield cuprum spears, which is all you need, while still having 170HP and roughly 60 PSY. Sure my damage bonus is only 18% but I still chunk. That is dumb.



I still enjoy mounted and play it for that reason not because its OP and I want to abuse shit. It really annoys me that people just start blasting you for playing anything but footfighter these days.

I cant argue much about the state of MAs since I couldnt come up with a counter to them other than MCs and MMs so do with that what you will. Atleast they dont deal that much damage I guess? I also wont adress whitebears since its not really in the name of the forum thread and I dont have that much experience fighting against them. When I used them I mostly used them for defensive purposes killing naked griefers.

I expect alot of this to either be ignored or shit talked since I am in Old Guard and people hate us for using mounteds now that horse armor came out. I just wanted to get my opinion out there. Cheers chaps.



tl:dr for those too lazy to read:
-Stop basing skill in the game on foot fighting
-Mounted Armor is too strong with very little downside
-Magery is too easy to splash into Mounted Builds making them sustain monsters
-Weapon selection as MC is really skewed/boring
-I am scared of lances to be honest
-There are dismounts you can use but not nearly enough
-Dismounting doesnt punish the rider enough (might get fixed this patch)
-Some people dont enjoy footfighting but rather enjoy Magery and Mounted combat without ill intentions. Deal with it.

 

[zers]

The one thing that always annoyed me is that whole footfighter elitism that is floating around in this community.
Apparently its the only class where you can prove your skill. If you play Mage or Mounted youre just a noob who likes clicking one button.

What if I actually enjoy those playstyles and dislike footfighting because of the whole beyblade stuff and constant cirklejerking?

Well anyways I just wanted to get this one out of the way real quick.

Imo MC definetly does need some work. I defiently disagree with it being OP before horse armor... a longbowman could 3 shot your horse easily from a mile away which was just dumb. I do however agree that the values on horse armor are a bit skewed since they can reach player armor levels without a big downside. Its mainly the stam management that goes to hell but that only really matters against other mounteds anyways.

Even master snipers only deal around 45damage against my molarium guard fur horse while I only lost like 10% momentum.

I also dislike how one dimensional MCs are since swinging weapons is hard as fudge while couching just deals more damage and is easier. Swinging doesnt even get the same momentum treatment for some reason (2 trot and 3 trot damage are the same when using swings unless they changed it this patch).



Currently alot of footies love running around with their duel meta weapons and dont bother using Mauls and Axes which can both dismount well enough and keep complaining about how you cant dismount MCs. I do agree that there needs to be more since picking up balance eliminates Axes for the most part but complaining without having tried those weapons and doing some practice is dumb. Ive rode into tons of spear/sword wielding footies because no one wants to use blunt weapons so there is no reason to be scared at all. If atleast 2 of those used maces and are as good as they claim they could easily dismount me.

Its just important that the dismounting actually fucks the rider hard which isnt the case currently.

I also agree that magery is way too easy to splash into mounted builds because of the lack of DEX investment needed which gives them unnatural sustain. I literally made a character with 121INT and enough STR to wield cuprum spears, which is all you need, while still having 170HP and roughly 60 PSY. Sure my damage bonus is only 18% but I still chunk. That is dumb.



I still enjoy mounted and play it for that reason not because its OP and I want to abuse shit. It really annoys me that people just start blasting you for playing anything but footfighter these days.

I cant argue much about the state of MAs since I couldnt come up with a counter to them other than MCs and MMs so do with that what you will. Atleast they dont deal that much damage I guess? I also wont adress whitebears since its not really in the name of the forum thread and I dont have that much experience fighting against them. When I used them I mostly used them for defensive purposes killing naked griefers.

I expect alot of this to either be ignored or shit talked since I am in Old Guard and people hate us for using mounteds now that horse armor came out. I just wanted to get my opinion out there. Cheers chaps.



tl:dr for those too lazy to read:
-Stop basing skill in the game on foot fighting
-Mounted Armor is too strong with very little downside
-Magery is too easy to splash into Mounted Builds making them sustain monsters
-Weapon selection as MC is really skewed/boring
-I am scared of lances to be honest
-There are dismounts you can use but not nearly enough
-Dismounting doesnt punish the rider enough (might get fixed this patch)
-Some people dont enjoy footfighting but rather enjoy Magery and Mounted combat without ill intentions. Deal with it.

Another thing with mounted is just that it's so zerg friendly. I can easily 1v2 even 1v3 and 1v4 against footfighters but against 1 mounted I have absolutely no way to win. If they are bad I can survive but I have no way of killing them or their mount. They can choose to disengage/engage whenever they want.

I understand the game isn't centered around solo gameplay but even upscaled like 10v15 its just impossible. Small scale and fighting outnumbered is completely ruined and at this point it's just the side with the most numbers. It's just so easy that everyone can pick up mounted and play at top level in 1 day while footfighting requires A LOT more skill. It's truly a huge difference in skill required. Not only the skill aspect of it but also the few counterplays vs mounted only works with equal numbers.

In conclusion footfighter vs footfighter is less dependant on numbers and gear and more dependant on skill while footfighter vs mounted is less dependant on skill and more dependant on gear, horse lvl and numbers. It's the same thing for mounted vs mounted aswell.

It's not a suprise the guilds with the most numbers want horses to be overpowered. But me and a lot others like when skill has an impact and not just gear, horse lvl and most importantly numbers. Atleast SV added the reserve system as a way to fight zergs according to Henrik. That truly helped.

If they want to make the game less skill based to appeal to the bad gamers and casuals they should make footfighter vs footfighter much easier.

 

[Tzone]

The reason your guild will go right back to fighting on foot:

You will run around as a mounted zerg, killing other mounteds and 1-3 person groups of footies who decided to run across open plains. Eventually you will run into a foot zerg of equal or greater number. You will realize you can't engage them in any winnable fashion, that they have the mass advantage by being so tightly grouped and on top of eachother in large numbers. So after losing 1-2 of your party because they overextended and got surrounded, stuck, or dismounted- you will ride away knowing that you missed out on an epic footfight that you spent all night hunting.

Mounteds always win small scale, but foot will always be meta for group pvp. Nerfing mounted will never give you what you want because not only will you never get more of the footfights you crave, you will just have less players in the game.

I just hope SV realizes that this time around.

Thats MO1 this is MO2. Different game but making similar mistakes. Right now Mounted zerg > foot zerg. We are even killing larger numbers with only a couple of mounteds. Do days ago when they still had people log in, it would be 2-3 mounted winning v 10-12 people. Its utterly broken and we will still abuse it untill they nerf it. When we were fighting large number of foot and mounted v mounted zerg it was very noticable how OP mounteds were in large scale. Why would you have footies that would fall behind you highly moblie mounted which can kill any thing easily.


A lot of the people who think mounted are fine and such are there in meduli getting killedby our mounted 3v6 too. Its so braindead to play yet they still are horrible at it that a foot fighter can reroll and the next day deafeat them over and over as a mounted. Its players with poor mechanical skill who are defending mounted and they are dying to our mounted now unable to leave meduli.

Talking about elitism this and that when these mounted mains get out played by a person who just rerolled to mounted and has less then a dozen hours on mounted. Mounted players talk a lot of stuff about how they were smarter at building a charater or what ever on the face lie to justify abusing mounted, sounds more elitest then anything I ever heard from any footy. Mounted have been the most elitist sounding people in this game and are being put into their place now by better players who are also abusing mounted.


The beatings will continue untill mounted is nerf and foot fighters are playable. Non of they carebear buff other stuff instead of fixing what is clearly broken either. If SV doesnt the right thing and fix mounted we will move onto abusing pet classes to try and force SV to fix that too.

 

[Bladeer01]

mo1 player here

as long as horse and gear are equal to each other

mc vs mc depend of skill

mc vs ma is first to see the other win

mc vs cqc foot errrr RIP ?

mc vs foot archer RIP too ?


the solution are easy i think ,


1) make bow able to dismount ( all weapon in fact )

2) make horse feel the damage ( need multiple hitboxs for that ) leg hit ? slow down or dismount if below 50% hp; body or head hit ? dismount if below 50% / make the horse go out of control

3) drop horse hp pool , it's a horse that should die to max 2 headshot or 3/4 body shot ( without armor ) not a molva ! ( while you're at it , fix the fall damage so they don't insta die from a 50 cm fall ^^ )

 

[Teknique]

I’d like to be the positive one here and encourage everyone to shit talk each other more.
These forums have a limited amount of entertaining threads. Please do the right thing and continue flaming each other

it’s the least you can do

 

[Tzone]

I really like the dismounting idea from arrows Idea. I would try to keep it to long bows which higher damage tho. A long bow shooting longbow arrow should weak spot but instead of extra damage, have it do knockdown/dismount. Even to foot.

With marksmanship skill weakspot is around 2 out of every 3 shots. Then you can have a check against the players knowdown resistance. I say have it start at 25% and for every 10 points they put into the resist they get 5% added. This could also force them to stop playing MC/MA/MM hybrid builds.

Maybe broad heads could have a dismount chance too but the opponent would start with 50% base line resist.

 

[Woody]

I really like the dismounting idea from arrows Idea. I would try to keep it to long bows which higher damage tho. A long bow shooting longbow arrow should weak spot but instead of extra damage, have it do knockdown/dismount. Even to foot.

With marksmanship skill weakspot is around 2 out of every 3 shots. Then you can have a check against the players knowdown resistance. I say have it start at 25% and for every 10 points they put into the resist they get 5% added. This could also force them to stop playing MC/MA/MM hybrid builds.

Maybe broad heads could have a dismount chance too but the opponent would start with 50% base line resist.

Agreed but feel as though WS is something that should be reserved to tighten up the Dex archers who won't primarily be using longbows. WS is also already well defined as 100% armor pen and therefore giving it two effects could be problematic. I would argue that you can still allow longbows to dismount on a damage threshold basis, and then increase or decrease the threshold amount with the knockdown resistance the player has.

 

[Tzone]

Agreed but feel as though WS is something that should be reserved to tighten up the Dex archers who won't primarily be using longbows. WS is also already well defined as 100% armor pen and therefore giving it two effects could be problematic. I would argue that you can still allow longbows to dismount on a damage threshold basis, and then increase or decrease the threshold amount with the knockdown resistance the player has.

Yeah but I would say shooting a mounted i the chest with a arrow to dismount him would be too easy and then head shots would still need some sort factor to limit dismounts as well. Dex already increases WS. Its noticeable between a 116 and a 126 dex build. MS is what you need to WS with bows but its really not worth it because long bows are the only worthwhile foot bow for group fights, and especially against mounted.

Long bows arrows do not do weakspot damage, one broad heads. Thats why I say have longbow arrows which IRL are very hefty and thick which tapered ends because normal arrows would snap if you tried to use them on a English long bow. Its the same force as getting a bat swung into you.

 

[Woody]

Yeah but I would say shooting a mounted i the chest with a arrow to dismount him would be too easy and then head shots would still need some sort factor to limit dismounts as well. Dex already increases WS. Its noticeable between a 116 and a 126 dex build. MS is what you need to WS with bows but its really not worth it because long bows are the only worthwhile foot bow for group fights, and especially against mounted.

Long bows arrows do not do weakspot damage, one broad heads. Thats why I say have longbow arrows which IRL are very hefty and thick which tapered ends because normal arrows would snap if you tried to use them on a English long bow. Its the same force as getting a bat swung into you.

Yup you'd need to lower the base WS proc chance to accomodate for the fact that

a) you're dealing damage/ws damage at range
b) it's across all body parts

And I feel the dismount mechanics would need to proc off all body parts because having to go for the head to knockdown is both a) silly and b) much harder especially on a moving target. As you mentioned as well, because longbows don't do WS and should stay this way for now; I'm more for a similar system outside the WS mechanic that allows for a dismount.

 

[Kebek]

3) drop horse hp pool , it's a horse that should die to max 2 headshot or 3/4 body shot ( without armor ) not a molva ! ( while you're at it , fix the fall damage so they don't insta die from a 50 cm fall ^^ )

I've had a 125 horse drop to 3-4 arrow shots with armor on. Not steel, granted, but molarium + guard fur is considerably better than no armor. So dropping the HP even more will basically have horses die in 1 or 2 shots unarmored.

 

[zers]

I've had a 125 horse drop to 3-4 arrow shots with armor on. Not steel, granted, but molarium + guard fur is considerably better than no armor. So dropping the HP even more will basically have horses die in 1 or 2 shots unarmored.

A lvl 125 horse has 315 hp- For 4 arrows to kill it they need to do >79 dmg per arrow. And 3 arrows would require >105 dmg per arrow. Even the best 123 str long bow does not deal that much damage to molarium + guard fur. Stop spreading lies and do the math. Or maybe you just don't know anything about this subject?

Btw it's 4 arrows with the best lvl 123 str bow to kill a lvl 125 horse WITHOUT any armor.

 

[Kebek]

Maybe you haven't seen the best long bow yet. Horse was getting hit for 80+.
Now, I'm not going to accuse you of lying, just of ignorance.

 

[zers]

Maybe you haven't seen the best long bow yet. Horse was getting hit for 80+.
Now, I'm not going to accuse you of lying, just of ignorance.

I highly doubt there is anything better than spongewood/crepite bows which makes the max range 102.69

 

[Rhias]

I highly doubt there is anything better than spongewood/crepite bows which makes the max range 102.69

In theory a thursar with the +10 str clade buff could use a 131 str long bow for the duration of 4 arrows.
That would make it 108.91 range.

 

[Kebek]

I highly doubt there is anything better than spongewood/crepite bows which makes the max range 102.69

I would very much like to know what bow it was and how to make it myself but the numbers are the numbers.
And it's also possible to make better bows than spongewood/crepite. Same damage but more durability and weakspot.

 

[zers]

lol

They actually buffed mounted.

 

[Tzone]

I've offered a rebuttal plenty of times in the past. I honestly don't know why I post on these threads. Its always just arguing with someone else with a different perspective than you whose unable to change it. I lose braincells every time.

Do everyone a favor and block us all.


champ

Hes a shitter, just block him and leave him alone. Its not like you even need to havea rebuttle to his non existant arguments. Do you argue with thin air? If no then why even look at Hyenas post.

lol

They actually buffed mounted.

I guess we just need abuse mounted even harder. They arent crying for nerfs yet. Only the people outplaying the mounted mains on mounted are calling for justified nerfs right now. Dont even like playing it, too brain dead.