How Do We Fix The Economy(/Game)?

[Albanjo Dravae]

I believe there's inequality.

If you can prove there are banks full of duped gold, then do so. I don't see the evidence. People having stacks of gold doesn't mean it's duped.

I don't have to prove you anything tho, i know and reported many of the vulnerabilities with the game, i know theres people that duped i know duping still is possible and like molag said SV does nothing about it because they never made basic tracking tools to redflag certain game events.
You could believe me or not and it won't matter because it's not up to you to fix it either way.

I'm not just implying people duped because they have gold. Duping is not a myth", that you don't know how to is another thing.

 

[Albanjo Dravae]

To the wipe dumbasses. Lets say they did a wipe today. What would happen in 6 months? You'd all be asking for a wipe again. The game needs to get good, wipes are just a bandaid. Anyone whos an actual MO vet knows full well that there will be plenty more dupes, exploits, ect over time. So it blows my mind that its lots of vets asking for a wipe. We got one, it was called MO2, and the eco is already shit. Games not even a year old yet lmao.

A wipe is useless if they don't fix shit prior, but both things are off the table.

 

[Ichorous]

I don't have to prove you anything tho, i know and reported many of the vulnerabilities with the game, i know theres people that duped i know duping still is possible and like molag said SV does nothing about it because they never made basic tracking tools to redflag certain game events.
You could believe me or not and it won't matter because it's not up to you to fix it either way.

I'm not just implying people duped because they have gold. Duping is not a myth", that you don't know how to is another thing.

You don't need to prove anything to anyone, that is correct. But why would you not want to?

Don't you want people to believe you? Otherwise, what are you even doing posting about duping in this thread?

 

[Albanjo Dravae]

You don't need to prove anything to anyone, that is correct. But why would you not want to?

Don't you want people to believe you? Otherwise, what are you even doing posting about duping in this thread?

I don't need people in these forums to believe me, what are you going to do Ich, message Henrique and tell him to fix what they couldn't in more than a decade?
Its not that this haven't been reported repeatedly. Problem is you don't even need to touch the kernel for injecting dlls to bypass EAC, doesn't require packet tracking or reverse engineering, duping is way easier. But that you ain't aware of this doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

 

[Ichorous]

I don't need people in these forums to believe me, what are you going to do Ich, message Henrique and tell him to fix what they couldn't in more than a decade?
Its not that this haven't been reported repeatedly. Problem is you don't even need to touch the kernel for injecting dlls to bypass EAC, doesn't require packet tracking or reverse engineering, duping is way easier. But that you ain't aware of this doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

It's not just me reading this conversation, friend. We are all having this conversation about fixing the economy. Are you just here to tell everyone it's hopeless, or do you have ideas to share?

You seem to believe that duping is a problem merely because it is possible to do. I too believe that it's possible. I've seen video evidence of people bypassing EAC. What I'm skeptical about is that people are duping and getting away with it on a large enough scale to have an irreversible impact (for example "banks full of duped gold").

 

[Albanjo Dravae]

It's not just me reading this conversation, friend. We are all having this conversation about fixing the economy. Are you just here to tell everyone it's hopeless, or do you have ideas to share?

You seem to believe that duping is a problem merely because it is possible to do. I too believe that it's possible. I've seen video evidence of people bypassing EAC. What I'm skeptical about is that people are duping and getting away with it on a large enough scale to have an irreversible impact (for example "banks full of duped gold").

Not saying everything is hopeless, just saying duping has been and still is possible. What makes you think people don't get away with massive duping, thats most of the G2G or playerauctions gold being sold for usd. I've provided, in this thread my ideas on how the lack of feature design affects the economy and how do i think should work instead.

Duping is a problem because its possible to do and they can't track it, and they won't ever aknowledge that, nobody needs to bypass EAC for duping thats for sure. I truly don't know what amount of duped gold you consider its irreversible, but its probably already there. People don't dupe 2k gold for buying a spiritism scroll, they will dupe as much as they can man, and they been doing it since release

 

[Ichorous]

What makes you think people don't get away with massive duping,

Because material prices are stable. That shouldn't happen if duped gold is truly abundant. People would spend it, and it would drive prices upward very noticeably.

 

[Emdash]

I believe there's inequality.

If you can prove there are banks full of duped gold, then do so. I don't see the evidence. People having stacks of gold doesn't mean it's duped.

I think dupe is almost a meme that could even be interpreted duplicitous. I'm sure some people have stacks of gold, but dudes talking about getting stacks of gold off flux farm is . Or whatever else they did. Zers said he spent 25 stacks of gold on a trinket. lol. There was a risar glitch, so let's say that there have been dubious methods to make money. I def don't think it's truly duped in most cases. But the unit of work is off, it's too wildly diff in value. It may recover from the shock, but I wonder. It really depends on getting new players on, so we gotta help 'em. :/

I don't think your intake should be completely due to your connections. Like I said, I still mine. IT'S COOL. It's not worth it in any way, but it's something I do. lol. Beefin w/ people in game makes me wanna mine, but yeah there is imbalance, and I dunno if it's gonna fix, or if by the time it fixes there will be much left.

 

[Albanjo Dravae]

Because material prices are stable. That shouldn't happen if duped gold is truly abundant. People would spend it, and it would drive prices upward very noticeably.

Is that the parameter of healthy for the game's economy? Prices are stable so theres no duped gold?

 

[Kaquenqos]

To the wipe dumbasses. Lets say they did a wipe today. What would happen in 6 months? You'd all be asking for a wipe again. The game needs to get good, wipes are just a bandaid. Anyone whos an actual MO vet knows full well that there will be plenty more dupes, exploits, ect over time. So it blows my mind that its lots of vets asking for a wipe. We got one, it was called MO2, and the eco is already shit. Games not even a year old yet lmao.

Yeah, if there 'was' a wipe, which I don't think there will be, it would only make sense to happen after the game has perfect polish, no bugs are possible, and all sandbox mechanics are fleshed out to make the end-game fun.

So, basically, Henrik isn't lying... It will never happen...! ;: ))

 

[Ichorous]

Prices are stable so theres no duped gold?

Yes, that's more or less what I'm saying.

 

[Ichorous]

I think dupe is almost a meme that could even be interpreted duplicitous. I'm sure some people have stacks of gold, but dudes talking about getting stacks of gold off flux farm is . Or whatever else they did. Zers said he spent 25 stacks of gold on a trinket. lol. There was a risar glitch, so let's say that there have been dubious methods to make money. I def don't think it's truly duped in most cases. But the unit of work is off, it's too wildly diff in value. It may recover from the shock, but I wonder. It really depends on getting new players on, so we gotta help 'em. :/

I don't think your intake should be completely due to your connections. Like I said, I still mine. IT'S COOL. It's not worth it in any way, but it's something I do. lol. Beefin w/ people in game makes me wanna mine, but yeah there is imbalance, and I dunno if it's gonna fix, or if by the time it fixes there will be much left.

This would explain a lot. Just people meaning different things when they say the word "dupe."

 

[Bigbadwolff]

Most of the problems with dupes and hacks come from guys that use the gold for RMT, they dont care about the game, developers or the player base its just a other paying job for them, the are a lot of online games that closed because of this and some of them put up gold in cash shop at a cheaper prices just to combat this, the problem that it makes the game pay to win.

The only logical thing is for dev team is to fix this and ban dupers/hackers, and then will see.

 

[TheHeretic]

Most of the problems with dupes and hacks come from guys that use the gold for RMT, they dont care about the game, developers or the player base its just a other paying job for them, the are a lot of online games that closed because of this and some of them put up gold in cash shop at a cheaper prices just to combat this, the problem that it makes the game pay to win.

The only logical thing is for dev team is to fix this and ban dupers/hackers, and then will see.

I can say NO. Seriously NO.
Because i know people who use cheats in MO1 (i sell they ass to Discord ) and do it cuz they want to feel POWWWEEERR! U can kill, can got fun and i sure its more reason to use cheats rn.

About all other. Wipe is not a exit. I lost thousands of game time and now you want to say me -Forgoth about it? I have like a 3 raw stacks golds, toons of materials, but ye biy, i worked hard.

 

[Emdash]

This would explain a lot. Just people meaning different things when they say the word "dupe."

Yeah, I think it's just a buzzword. Things obtained in a bogus way.

Also call me a theorist, but I believe the only paying job in regards to SV (unless it's players paying other players) is people paying SV. Unless some people up in the discord can really talk up that much of a storm, haha. In terms of direction, it's hard to imagine how a few of these ideas came together from the same 'vision.'

All n all tho, it's not bad AS A GAME IMO. It's just content, player related problems ( people having ez gold gains that they can get skews economy because they are also usually protected from pvp by being in a zerg or having lo risk, etc. Like doing MA, you can do that naked.)

What is a unit, though, in this economy, I wonder, what is the measurement? The basic thing. A lot of nerds on games calc gains per hour. MO is a lot more complex than that, but even on a scale like that, we can compare low gains (GY gains aren't that bad if you have a horse and pick up carcs tbh, jump on horse, speed to spot.) Sator carc gains are easy, Risars, when people aren't around, seem legit, ants are legit. Pretty much anyone can do that content if they have an MA and don't get ganked. I would call that midrange, then high range would be stuff you need like spiritism to do or stuff you need a big team to do.

 

[Bigbadwolff]

I can say NO. Seriously NO.
Because i know people who use cheats in MO1 (i sell they ass to Discord ) and do it cuz they want to feel POWWWEEERR! U can kill, can got fun and i sure its more reason to use cheats rn.

About all other. Wipe is not a exit. I lost thousands of game time and now you want to say me -Forgoth about it? I have like a 3 raw stacks golds, toons of materials, but ye biy, i worked hard.

You can find anything for the right price if you google it, and that gold is not made with hard work killing bush pigs .

I wonder how much was worth those stacks of gold you have?

 

[TheHeretic]

You can find anything for the right price if you google it, and that gold is not made with hard work killing bush pigs .

I wonder how much was worth those stacks of gold you have?

I can be wrong with understanding what you mean, but yes, i know about RMT in MMO. How i think, its not a bad for game, cuz that materials and golds collected in games and lost in game in the last point (guy who buy it). That was break the rule, but if you collect golds or materials with your hard work, i thinks its fair.
I know people who pay for subs. I know people who sell it for profit IRL. Game alive to many years, worked good and i didnt see any problems with this.
But yes, i understand you if we are talk about cheats. Lets be clear. Games with thousands billions price and super deffence still have a problems with cheaters, and this problem not about only RMT. Then how say, i hate cheating, exploiting, i do all to delete from game. But better talk about to it to GM and explain them about it and how it works, cuz they didnt have Batta testers, alot of money and they didnt play.

 

[TheHeretic]

You can find anything for the right price if you google it, and that gold is not made with hard work killing bush pigs .

I wonder how much was worth those stacks of gold you have?

If we are talked about me, i have a rules - 250 raw golds in a day, 20 stacks any ores in a day. All other just if i have a good feells from the process.
How i know, maximum solo profit is like a 150g in a houre + trinkets. Then, its just a fun time with movies on backyard
And this is solo client. With 2 windows its be faster and more profitable.

 

[Emdash]

If we are talked about me, i have a rules - 250 raw golds in a day, 20 stacks any ores in a day. All other just if i have a good feells from the process.
How i know, maximum solo profit is like a 150g in a houre + trinkets. Then, its just a fun time with movies on backyard
And this is solo client. With 2 windows its be faster and more profitable.

Still: much respect for heretic and playing legit

Much sad for having to process 20 stacks a day haha.

 

[Albanjo Dravae]

Yes, that's more or less what I'm saying.

It doesn't work like that, this is not a country thats printing bills and devaluating the currency. Gold is off the grid, meaning that what you see" as devaluation or not is relative, there are some indicators theres an obsene amount of gold going around.

This would explain a lot. Just people meaning different things when they say the word "dupe."

Duping is duplicating an item.
Exploiting mechanics to earn" more gold is not duping, its exploiting.

Flux exploit wasn't duping, it was an exploit of an "unintended mechanic" and they didn't do anything about it, they just let some people get filthy ritch.

The implications of both are bad, except some people gets banned while others are let to continue exploiting.

Yeah, I think it's just a buzzword. Things obtained in a bogus way.

Also call me a theorist, but I believe the only paying job in regards to SV (unless it's players paying other players) is people paying SV. Unless some people up in the discord can really talk up that much of a storm, haha. In terms of direction, it's hard to imagine how a few of these ideas came together from the same 'vision.'

All n all tho, it's not bad AS A GAME IMO. It's just content, player related problems ( people having ez gold gains that they can get skews economy because they are also usually protected from pvp by being in a zerg or having lo risk, etc. Like doing MA, you can do that naked.)

What is a unit, though, in this economy, I wonder, what is the measurement? The basic thing. A lot of nerds on games calc gains per hour. MO is a lot more complex than that, but even on a scale like that, we can compare low gains (GY gains aren't that bad if you have a horse and pick up carcs tbh, jump on horse, speed to spot.) Sator carc gains are easy, Risars, when people aren't around, seem legit, ants are legit. Pretty much anyone can do that content if they have an MA and don't get ganked. I would call that midrange, then high range would be stuff you need like spiritism to do or stuff you need a big team to do.

The "its just a game" argument for justifying, exploits, bugs, dupes and the lack of development doesn't apply. Of course its just a game, you might not be directly affected by gold dupers but it goes against each fiber of the game and it's competitive nature. Its mind blowing they didn't address this shit from the start and they let the same shit that happened in MO1 to continue happening now.

GY gains is fucking insulting, its insulting anyone has to farm that piece of garbage to thrive. GY is the ultimate troll piece of shit placeholder mechanic to make noobs quit the game. The fact you saying this just makes me think you are completly unaware of how much gold people get from other mechanics.
For example people were doing at least an average of 1k gold per hour on group flux farming pre-nerf. Check how many days people had to farm that shit since trinckets came out till got nerfed and do the math.

PVE is total trash tho, AI is non existant and the fact anyone gotta roll MA to farm stupid ass broken animation creatures is terrible.