SV are you going to shaft your noob and RP playerbase again like you did in MO1? Humans need love.
Fix Humans
- Thread starter Grudge Bringer
- Start date
The entire attribute and clade system needs a complete overhaul for humans to ever be a viable pick in the game. Humans keeping their mortal 1 stat caps just keeps them worse than alvarin (tindremic/sarducaan) and oghmir/thursar (kallard, khurite), while also having some of the least impactful clade gifts in the game.
I have played all 4 clades in the beta and the difference between playing a Tindremene and a Sheevra is night and day, you have basically the same hp pool, but are way faster with better stamina as well. Melee wise I dont even feel weaker as a Sheevra and their pretty high attribute pool still lets them be flexible like a full Tind, but with far better survivability. Hell you can even still use a tungsteel tipped lance as a Full sheevra and wont get a heavy weapon debuff as a MC.
I have played all 4 clades in the beta and the difference between playing a Tindremene and a Sheevra is night and day, you have basically the same hp pool, but are way faster with better stamina as well. Melee wise I dont even feel weaker as a Sheevra and their pretty high attribute pool still lets them be flexible like a full Tind, but with far better survivability. Hell you can even still use a tungsteel tipped lance as a Full sheevra and wont get a heavy weapon debuff as a MC.
If they ever split healing and magic damage to make heals scale off psyche like I've suggested, humans would move dramatically up the meta for mages/hybrids. Especially Sarduucans.
If they ever dumped Khurite con in exchange for a big buff to STR/DEX making it the only glass cannon race in the game and a really strong build for mounted melee/archery that would buff humans as well.
I don't think you need too much more than that. Full Kallard is definitely not terrible right now. It fits fairly well into the FF+MA meta.
If they ever dumped Khurite con in exchange for a big buff to STR/DEX making it the only glass cannon race in the game and a really strong build for mounted melee/archery that would buff humans as well.
I don't think you need too much more than that. Full Kallard is definitely not terrible right now. It fits fairly well into the FF+MA meta.
The day Sardu is viable in pvp I'm gonna shit myself. I do think humans should be a leeetle faster. Also clades. FAK. I got a hum 26 khur max height (wtb shrink food,) and she isn't really strong enough for true MC weps (110-115 str not good enough,) so I'm thinking of respec... or a reroll token haha. But it goes to show you how hard it is to build w/ a human.
It's like their ideal build is some mounted archer/mage w/ heavier armor haha. MANY NEW CLADES. Man I would love to see clades for the dominant race in human (at least ) altho people can use creative mechanics to basically choose their main race... but that's still better. I got a whole hat full of possible human clades and yea their stam is bad cept on KHUR which is OK. That whole 245(4?)-248 speed cluster is bad for the game IMO.
I'd fight a full kall w/ my full khur, on ground or on mount. - shrug - I mean it's ok but... still not good.
I break down the differences in a lot of detail here. Basic summary, Khurites and Kallards are essentially the same build except Khurites are faster on foot to a non-noticable degree (And I'd cite the placebo effect if you think you've noticed it) and Kallards are healthier/higher damage to a slightly noticeable degree.
My idea is nerf the crap out of Khurite con and then buff their strength and dex even further / match their attribute cap with a Kallard. It actually turns them into two different builds with more arguable merits. And it also makes Khurites (who are based on Mongolians) arguably the best race for MA/MC.
One of the biggest upsides is this is we have Kallards, all thursars, and all ohgmir as a high health, high damage build. We have Veela as lower damage, lower health, higher speed. Excellent damage, moderate speed, low health does not exist among pure fighter builds. This change would create an entirely new build that currently does not exist but is balanced with existing roles and fits well into the very mixable human race.
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Humans can have way more mana than an Alv at higher str. They have same attributes as MO1 but with clades is a bit higher. They also can fit noticeably more profession skills, because clades and int. Vs say a thur which gets nothing from int and has no clade gifts for crafting skills. So humans can fit like 2 more skills. So for someone trying to do a lot with 1 Acc humans can do the most. That said for Pvp they are pretty eh but that usually doesnt matter most fights in this game aren't fair. Humans issue is because they are the highest mana with max other stats they are only good for hybrids and paladins. If you play full fighter or full mage they are junk and worse than other races. Which means the human races that are only good at being fighters completely suck and are bad thursars. Pure khurite has some potential tho.
honestly sardu is a safer pick than tindy because of the con gap, they get a bit more stam and hp which lets them survive better, i played a 2x sardu 1x tind 1x sido paladin before which had 104 con, 100 int, 104 str fully built which was neat. also I do have the max stam of the purebloods at the same age.
Tind stam: 354 Sard stam: 359 Sido stam: 367 Khurite stam: 382 Kallard stam: 382
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good luck getting anything anymore XD
Humans flat out sucked in MO1 unless you were a khurite. But in MO1 speed worked differently it was based off of height, dex and con. Which meant tall high dex and high con characters like Thursar-Khurites were the king of speed and thus meta.
You also didnt have clades, or anything that made any of the races other than Thursars, oghmir, or alvarin kings. Humans just sucked in MO1. I know I played one for 13 years.
D
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The group clade needs to be reworked, and the other unimplemented clade gifts given function. I don't think human are in a bad spot if the Alvarin are adjusted. The Oghmir and Thursar are given tools to help combat the Alvarin, but the human really aren't given anything. Maybe give them a passive mana gain clade kinda how the Thursar has the passive health gain clade.
Ultimately, the other races like the human really can't compete until the Alvarin meta race is changed.
Ultimately, the other races like the human really can't compete until the Alvarin meta race is changed.
rework the warcry. The anti magic warcry aint good and veela has a personal one thats better. make it non anti magic effect. Thusar cry and ogh cry arent as good as alvarian but at least they have a effect in fighting instead of being super situational as most of the time you are not worried as a group about taking random magic damage which is counted by mage heals.
No good group really runs humans for a reason.
Also humans with just a little bit more stamina could be very viable. Ogh defense, thusar damage, alvarian speed. Human could have the stamina to balance out the clade.
No good group really runs humans for a reason.
Also humans with just a little bit more stamina could be very viable. Ogh defense, thusar damage, alvarian speed. Human could have the stamina to balance out the clade.
Humans should have a roleplaying war cry that just shouts racial insults at nearby players specific to their race when you press it and gives temporary larger modifier to vendor prices called Entitlement
yea man. I'm running like Sardu stats on my Khurite atm. Not high enough to do MC in str. Their con is nice. Got 200~ HP even with reduced con (but I need to shrink too.) I dunno what to do w/ my Khur. I think humans do well to expose the fact that you have to fit into... mage, FF, mounted... and almost no humans excel at that. 115 str isn't... enough. It's the lowest other-than elves which are stupidfast. The dex is stuck in the ball of 'barely faster.' A more advanced clade tree w/ specific gifts for your main race would be good. Attribute wise, their spread is just trash. I tried n tried. I would take a full townie crafter over what they are. Not that they can't do work, but they aren't unique. Anything w/ 85 str can MA someone's horse.
Would really like to see humans get mounted buffs. Not necessarily wheelchair, but since they already got ruff ryder, it would be nice to flesh that out. Some + while mounted might be nice. Imagine if humans had like veela gift except for horse speed
2.5% more speed 
i mean i have been RPing a tinredmic battle mage , hes verry racist aginst the thursars cuz they smell bad. hes also racist against the other races .. however it is just RP no real racism lol.
Idk why everyone thinks human is so terrible, i mean balancing is allways good but are we forgetting mana-armor regen clade? Thats a magery boost no other class has, making it a specially versatile hybrid.
I rather see magery balanced instead or any clade changes to be honest.
I don't think it's enough. If you're a tin, you're gonna get body bagged when you do get hit even tho you can slam people with spells, so mainly you'd wanna just fight someone as a mage, but you're pretty slow. On a mount, it's interesting as well, but again you are so freaking paper. If someone hasn't put out the dmg, they should check y'know 96, 101, 110 115 120 125 cons and check out the damage it reduces w/ armor on.
If their attribute point things were like +8 or +10 that would be pretty sweet. Like double it +8 int +10 mana.
Do that w/ all their clades then double the maxes OR even make it 5 so that Khurite can get 120 dex, Kallad can get 120 str. - shrug- Would be a start. They are just too crippled w/ attributes atm IMO. They aren't BAD BAD. They just are definitely inferior, and they don't need to be, cuz they can do some things.
I think to a large the issue with human hybrids are a issue with hybrids in general. Essentially, you have to break away from combat long enough to cast a spell in order for your magic to be of any use to you at all. Alvarin using terrain, speed, and jumpcasting can achieve this. Other hybrids basically NEED to be ignored for a bit to make use of their magic as a dedicated melee will shut down that aspect of their build entirely, turning them into lightly armored, lower health, lower damage fighters.
We need some spells that can be cast while running and/or cast with a weapon out and parrying.
OBVIOUSLY, such spells need to have major drawbacks and limited strength. But if all hybrids could be weaving their magic into the fight at all times to SOME advantage, and then that advantage gets better if they are allowed to cast uninterrupted giving them access to all their spells... that right there would be the huge buff human hybrids need I think.
We need some spells that can be cast while running and/or cast with a weapon out and parrying.
OBVIOUSLY, such spells need to have major drawbacks and limited strength. But if all hybrids could be weaving their magic into the fight at all times to SOME advantage, and then that advantage gets better if they are allowed to cast uninterrupted giving them access to all their spells... that right there would be the huge buff human hybrids need I think.