Spiritism Feedback - My (painful) Experience

[Nefnate]

Hello all,

Most who have tried the current iteration of Spiritism agree it is lacking. Now that I have tried it on two characters in two locations, I'd like to chime in with hopes that it may be addressed before launch and new players discover it how it is.
EDIT: I do want to acknowledge that the general atmosphere and the animations are very nicely done - it feels ominious, otherworldly, and the spell effects are quite nice visually.

Spoiler: The Current Situation / My Experience So Far:

• The first thing I noticed are the spell costs. They do not seem consistent. There seems to be a, or multiple spells, that take more than they are supposed to.
  • Using a Single Spirit Box with 4 Spirits is sometimes enough for me to Portal/Banish and sometimes... not?
  • -
• The second is - without a portal, how am I supposed to do literally anything?
  • This may be intentional.
  • Without the Portal there is no way to get into the Ether to hunt Spirits, making it impossible to get more reagents.
  • -
• The Portal Animation makes you explode in death on the spot. This feels obnoxious.
  • A specific animation suited to the entering/exit of Portals would make this 100% more immersive.
  • -
• The Spells in Spiritism that require Spirits are mostly used specifically in the Ether.
  • Speed Up, Higher Regen, Defense, Ability to Banish, Portal.
  • Projectile feels weak compared to Ecumenical Alternatives and the Mana restoring spell is extremely niche.
  • This makes the school self serving... you need spiritism, to use Spiritism, repeat. It doesn't pay forward into the rest of the game.
  • -
• Finding a Spirit once I was in the Ether took a long time, and there were no hints or ways to track.
  • I ran around for over 10 minutes before a Spirit popped up for the first time.
  • This feels painfully slow.
  • -
• 'Fighting' the Spirits feels really lame. Tracking some small orbs is clunky/difficult and is not a dynamic encounter.
  • The Spirits don't move, there isn't much I noticed for sound. The entire mechanic around trying to defeat these things feels unfun.
  • -
• Spirits are very inconsistent.
  • Some of the Spirits I found attacked me quickly, others just let me kill them without ever attacking me.
  • Some of the Spirits faded away before the fight was over.
    • In these cases, only some of the time does an addition Seance bring them back. They completely stop existing the rest of the time.
  • -
• Spirit Drops are very inconsistent.
  • My first kill netted me 29 Spirits. This felt very rewarding, after hunting around for over 10 minutes and dealing with the awkward 'fight'.
  • My second kill gave me... 1 Spirit.
  • My third gave me 4....
  • -
• Trying to battle another Player feels jarring and difficult.
  • We move so quickly and erratically in the Ether that it feels extremely difficult to perfect trace an enemy to siphon their energy.
  • Fights last forever, or end quickly if you slack on your movement. In either case it does not feel fun.

The only thing I liked about Spiritism were some of the animations and concepts - the execution of almost everything felt off or bad. It is not fun and feels clunky. There is no decernible gameplay loop that connects back to the Over World, either. Below are suggestions I have for a more fun, engaging, smooth experience:

Spoiler: Suggestions for improvement:

• Make more spells useful outside of the Ether.
  • Self explanatory. There is just... no good reason to be a Spiritist other than Ressurect and Portalling into new areas.
  • If this is intended, there has to a better experience while in the Ether to make up for it.
  • -
• Allow us to cast the Buff spells while moving in the Ether.
  • It feels very frustrating to stop just to speed myself up, for example.
  • -
• Let the Priests send us to/from the Ether again with Boxes intact but halved.
  • This at least provides SOME form of other option.
  • -
• Change the Siphon style of attacking in the Ether to a short channel (0.5s?) that shows an animation of you pulling a small part of energy out of the target.
  • It would halt Kau regen for 1s on another player.
  • You still need to be accurate to get your mouse over and hold it for a short window.
  • You don't need to painfully squint (just me?) at the monitor and trace things in circles.
  • It would make Ether PvP a lot easier to deal with, too.
  • -
• Make the Spirit AI more dynamic.
  • Instead of tracing the small orbs to defeat the Spirits, make those purely weapons that indicate the strength of the Spirit.
    • Targetting them could turn them off, but not progress the fight.
    • Have them shoot semi-slow projectiles instead of a homing beam. This would let us move and dodge about and feel fun.
      • At the very least, have them do anything OTHER than the siphoning. It just doesn't look or feel good.
  • Have the Spirit Move around instead of being stationary.
  • -
• Normalize drop rates for Spirits and make them more accessible.
  • Narrow the range of spirits that can drop.
  • Increase the amount of Spirits in the world, or, enable us to see hints or otherwise track their existence.
  • Wandering the empty grey landscape spamming Seance is painful.
    • Especially when you only get 1 Spirit in your box from a victory after 10+ minutes...
  • -
• Create animations for entering and exiting a Portal.
  • Self explanatory.
  • -
• The Jellyfish model.... is odd. If that is sincerely what is intended, so be it. However, I am of the mind that it was an easy asset to throw in.
  • Create models more in line with Spiritism as a whole and that might link to how we players look.

In conclusion, I do not think Spiritism is in a playable state. It is not fun, clunky, and only serves itself and not other forms of play. A lot needs to be looked at and considered before anyone will consistently use it for fun or by choice - until then, I imagine the only players using it will be those who are after a very specific mechanic, or those who find a way to make gold via Spirit Boxes.

I would love to play a Spiritist. Currently, I cannot imagine doing so.

Cheers,
Nef.

 

[SirVirtuo]

Hello all,

Most who have tried the current iteration of Spiritism agree it is lacking. Now that I have tried it on two characters in two locations, I'd like to chime in with hopes that it may be addressed before launch and new players discover it how it is.

• Spoiler: The Current Situation / My Experience So Far:

  The first thing I noticed are the spell costs. They do not seem consistent. There seems to be a, or multiple spells, that take more than they are supposed to.
  

  • Using a Single Spirit Box with 4 Spirits is sometimes enough for me to Portal/Banish and sometimes... not?
  • -

  [*][*]The second is - without a portal, how am I supposed to do literally anything?
  

  • This may be intentional.
  • Without the Portal there is no way to get into the Ether to hunt Spirits, making it impossible to get more reagents.
  • -

  [*][*]The Portal Animation makes you explode in death on the spot. This feels obnoxious.
  

  • A specific animation suited to the entering/exit of Portals would make this 100% more immersive.
  • -

  [*][*]The Spells in Spiritism that require Spirits are mostly used specifically in the Ether.
  

  • Speed Up, Higher Regen, Defense, Ability to Banish, Portal.
  • Projectile feels weak compared to Ecumenical Alternatives and the Mana restoring spell is extremely niche.
  • This makes the school self serving... you need spiritism, to use Spiritism, repeat. It doesn't pay forward into the rest of the game.
  • -

  [*][*]Finding a Spirit once I was in the Ether took a long time, and there were no hints or ways to track.
  

  • I ran around for over 10 minutes before a Spirit popped up for the first time.
  • This feels painfully slow.
  • -

  [*][*]'Fighting' the Spirits feels really lame. Tracking some small orbs is clunky/difficult and is not a dynamic encounter.
  

  • The Spirits don't move, there isn't much I noticed for sound. The entire mechanic around trying to defeat these things feels unfun.
  • -

  [*][*]Spirits are very inconsistent.
  

  • Some of the Spirits I found attacked me quickly, others just let me kill them without ever attacking me.
  • Some of the Spirits faded away before the fight was over.
    • In these cases, only some of the time does an addition Seance bring them back. They completely stop existing the rest of the time.
  • -

  [*][*]Spirit Drops are very inconsistent.
  

  • My first kill netted me 29 Spirits. This felt very rewarding, after hunting around for over 10 minutes and dealing with the awkward 'fight'.
  • My second kill gave me... 1 Spirit.
  • My third gave me 4....
  • -

  [*][*]Trying to battle another Player feels jarring and difficult.
  

  • We move so quickly and erratically in the Ether that it feels extremely difficult to perfect trace an enemy to siphon their energy.
  • Fights last forever, or end quickly if you slack on your movement. In either case it does not feel fun.

  [*][*]

The only thing I liked about Spiritism were some of the animations and concepts - the execution of almost everything felt off or bad. It is not fun and feels clunky. There is no decernible gameplay loop that connects back to the Over World, either. Below are suggestions I have for a more fun, engaging, smooth experience:

• Spoiler: Suggestions for improvement:

  Make more spells useful outside of the Ether.
  

  • Self explanatory. There is just... no good reason to be a Spiritist other than Ressurect and Portalling into new areas.
  • If this is intended, there has to a better experience while in the Ether to make up for it.
  • -

  [*][*]Allow us to cast the Buff spells while moving in the Ether.
  

  • It feels very frustrating to stop just to speed myself up, for example.
  • -

  [*][*]Let the Priests send us to/from the Ether again with Boxes intact but halved.
  

  • This at least provides SOME form of other option.
  • -

  [*][*]Change the Siphon style of attacking in the Ether to a short channel (0.5s?) that shows an animation of you pulling a small part of energy out of the target.
  

  • It would halt Kau regen for 1s on another player.
  • You still need to be accurate to get your mouse over and hold it for a short window.
  • You don't need to painfully squint (just me?) at the monitor and trace things in circles.
  • It would make Ether PvP a lot easier to deal with, too.
  • -

  [*][*]Make the Spirit AI more dynamic.
  

  • Instead of tracing the small orbs to defeat the Spirits, make those purely weapons that indicate the strength of the Spirit.
    • Targetting them could turn them off, but not progress the fight.
    • Have them shoot semi-slow projectiles instead of a homing beam. This would let us move and dodge about and feel fun.
      • At the very least, have them do anything OTHER than the siphoning. It just doesn't look or feel good.
  • Have the Spirit Move around instead of being stationary.
  • -

  [*][*]Normalize drop rates for Spirits and make them more accessible.
  

  • Narrow the range of spirits that can drop.
  • Increase the amount of Spirits in the world, or, enable us to see hints or otherwise track their existence.
  • Wandering the empty grey landscape spamming Seance is painful.
    • Especially when you only get 1 Spirit in your box from a victory after 10+ minutes...
  • -

  [*][*]Create animations for entering and exiting a Portal.
  

  • Self explanatory.
  • -

  [*][*]The Jellyfish model.... is odd. If that is sincerely what is intended, so be it. However, I am of the mind that it was an easy asset to throw in.
  

  • Create models more in line with Spiritism as a whole and that might link to how we players look.

  [*][*]

In conclusion, I do not think Spiritism is in a playable state. It is not fun, clunky, and only serves itself and not other forms of play. A lot needs to be looked at and considered before anyone will consistently use it for fun or by choice - until then, I imagine the only players using it will be those who are after a very specific mechanic, or those who find a way to make gold via Spirit Boxes.

I would love to play a Spiritist. Currently, I cannot imagine doing so.

Cheers,
Nef.

Wow, you basically took my experience and response to it and made it 150% better and more organized... Hopefully the devs will see this post after being insulted by mine and take EVERYTHING you listed into consideration, because these are all excellent and absolutely doable changes. Only thing missing here is a list of potential overworld spells that could use spirits to enhance the gameplay of the spiritst and the other players around them. I recommend a spirit mage light and a like 30% mana regen buff that lasts like 10 minutes that you cast on individual players for like 3 spirits. Having the projectile charge only to fire when finished to be done while standing still is mega ridiculous. It's a tad strong for a spell to cast while moving, but if they reduce damage slightly and allow movement, i'd 100% love it.

 

[Icegoten]

You bring up some good points but one thing I want to bring up is finding spirits, the spirits themselves and their drops feeling inconsistent. When spiritism first came out in MO1 it was a similar experience to the one you're having now. I remember our one nudging hint for where to find spirits was something along the lines of checking places you would think have spirits and when everyone says graveyard we got a soft confirmation BUT hinted there was more to it than just that. So there is a design to it and personally I like it. This is one of those things where a player can explore the system and differentiate themselves from other spiritists with knowledge over skill.

Still at the end of the day it never felt fun so I hope they consider some of these changes and try redefining what purpose a spiritist has.

 

[Ranzu]

This you, this is great. The few people who ACTUALLY played and tested spiritism know that spiritism is lacking so much AND it has SOOOO much potential to be a great mechanic with a few minor tweaks before launch. I will die on this on this spiritism hill. Also, like in MO1 spiritists should be able to cast a spell to see the living (and become visible in the overworld) so people know spiritist mage is there. If not, please remove the ability that mental healing has to replnish mana in the overworld from the Ether. Really and truly it's just a big tease at this point. Just tweaking the damage in spiritist vs spiritist pvp will make a huge difference and be playable.

 

[Fargus]

In another thread they were talking about how traveling in ghost mode is a point that QoL could improve I honestly thinking adding the ability to banish or teleport ghost to specific towns would give spiritualist a great utility and way to make money that would be very unique.

 

[Rorry]

In another thread they were talking about how traveling in ghost mode is a point that QoL could improve I honestly thinking adding the ability to banish or teleport ghost to specific towns would give spiritualist a great utility and way to make money that would be very unique.

That would suck for all non sprirtists who have no way to defend themselves against being sent to the end of the world.

 

[Fargus]

That would suck for all non sprirtists who have no way to defend themselves against being sent to the end of the world.

Better being sent to the end of the world than a spiritist and a footie catching you in an endless deathloop for however long they feel like doing it.

 

[Evelyn]

decent suggestions, but toss in that buff timers need to not be terrible. 60 seconds (more like 55 tbh) is not enjoyable gameplay.

 

[ArcaneConsular]

the only use i've really found for it is taming / travel. Just portal in near a horse, tame a few, ride them back, and sell for gold. Probably the best way to sell horses atm until herding is added. If I had to list what I'd want changed I'd say

1. Buff Ether Momentum (basically useless right now)
2. Make it so friends can use your ether portal without ether portal lore
3. Either make mental projectile precastable or reduce the cast time/damage. Right now basically useless except for long-range attacks (if you can manage to hover over a moving target far away for so long). Can't use it on horseback* which makes it basically pointless as a mage. Hard to imagine seriously standing still and casting it at someone without getting wrecked by arrows are foot fighters

Like all magic in the game it seems to be really diminished due to fears of it being OP for no resources. I feel like adding magic armor would balance like every issue with mages by adding the needed extra mana regen and damage but also adding more risk to dying