Revert the Pet Changes Please They Are Horrible. Details Down Below. Criticism: From a BeastMaster.....

PoisonArrows

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1.) Taming Now Harder

Did the Devs actually test this first? I have a team right now and we are actually coming down the White Bear mountain and it is just ridiculous. You have to spam Tame over and over to finally tame the Bear. If you fail enough times it runs away and actually fully recovers it's hp. It actually takes quite a while. It never took this long before. And it doesn't make sense if i have maxed lores and everything I can possibly get for there to be a fail chance percentage so high. This also seems to happen with Taur dogs as well, and presumably all Pets. Where they will take a long time of spam taming before it actually works. (Imagine doing that to a Dragon or Troll and then tame doesn't work and then you die because it one shots you, it's not your fault tame didn't work but you got shafted anyway) (It's worth pointing out the White Bear used to run a certain path and then come back, enabling easier taming even when failing... But the Devs took that out as well, the Bear just runs all over the place now, and you have to run after it so good luck fat mages)







2.) Terrain Issues, Follow Command Issues, Log Spawn Issues that need badly reversed.


As if that isn't a pain in the ass already, once you tame the White Bear you have to then lure it down the mountain with uneven Terrain and Spam Follow Command. The Bear will stop following, it will then just be stuck, if you already walked a distance down the mountain or fell a little ways, there is no way to go another way to try to trick the bear to follow you. If the Terrain isn't completely even the Bear just sits there. So you have to log off and wait for the damn timer that takes about 2minutes, then you log back in to spawn it to you. This trick used to work to get it off the mountain in it's entirety, this is no longer the case, they made changes to make it so you can't log spawn your pet over great distances anymore. So once your bear gets stuck you have to log spawn it, but it can only be done short distances, this results in you having to do this repeatedly... Honestly the experience is horrible. It is akin to watching Paint Dry. At any point if you make a wrong move and fall off the damn mountain your bear can be stuck indefinitely making your entire trip and all the time put into it wasted! In addition if you forgot to tell your Bear to stay, and told it to follow you instead as you log out. Then the Bear will not spawn to you, so your bear could be stuck 50 feet above you on a mountain that way as well, in this case there is no way of rescuing the bear, unless you can somehow get to the top of the mountain again and somehow be within the short enough distance to spawn it above you, even though it is stuck down below... This is because once again you can't log spawn the pet over long distances. So unless you are right next to it, then Tough titties. Now once you get it down a certain distance the rest of the way is Flatter terrain and as long as you aren't ganked you finally have your damn white bear. If you do get ganked, then repeat trip up said Mountain and let's see how many times that is enjoyable to you.





3.) As well as a 3 hour Respawn Rate Wtf is this? Seriously.
Oh Wait, I forgot to mention the Spawn timer went from 30minutes to 3 hours. So funny enough for those of you who haven't read this you will go back up the mountain and wait for hours. This is even worse if at any point, any other team of tamers gets the Bear before your team logs on. You have no idea when it was last killed or tamed, and could be waiting there for 3 hours even with said knowledge. Once Release happens with populations increase, you could be waiting a very long time, or just have to get lucky to get a White Bear because of this timer. To Further emphasize what a pain in the ass this whole experience is, there isn't a safe place to kill the bear anymore either, they removed the Rock near the entrance to the cave as well as the ledge to jump on above it. So you pretty much need a team of 3 people, 2 mages to heal and 1 person to tank. Now once you have your white bear you have to of course level to max level which will take a while to do. Compare this to a MA which takes 10 seconds to tame a Horse and fully counters Beast Masters and then complain to me about balance.





4.) Buff Foot Fighters.

I just don't understand why Foot fighters can't get a Huge buff. Making our job harder as Tamers isn't fixing FF as the weakest Class in game. This is a very poor example of Class balancing, literally making our job harder as tamers does nothing to balance us vs FF. One way or another I'll get another pet, and another one, and another one. And the result of a Battle between me and a FF will remain the same, I will win every single time. The reality is simple, the design of the game makes Beast Masters win against Foot Fighters. Therefore trying to make Pets be balanced against FF is like trying to put someone's Vomit into a Dish to impress Gordan Ramsay it just doesn't work. You need to Buff Foot Fighters.


Bear in mind, a White Bear is a Slightly better Brown Bear. It is just bear-ly better. Like 10% better. But now 100x harder to get lmao.


5.) Side Note, Guards went full retard again

They don't serve their purpose not even in the bank when they are right next to you. Only the Lictors seem to operate the rest of the guards seem like their Ai only functions 10% of the time. Except those outside guards are always on point, but those guards in banks never work for some reason.
 
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Putzin

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I just noticed this today too when I tamed the White Bear I failed multiple times and I thought I dropped lores or something for a minute I was confused. Did they actually change something in the fail area of taming?
 

PoisonArrows

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I just noticed this today too when I tamed the White Bear I failed multiple times and I thought I dropped lores or something for a minute I was confused. Did they actually change something in the fail area of taming?
They must have changed something! What exactly I am unsure, I took a 3 week break and I came back and stables don't work and you can't even name your pets anymore. I had the same thought as you and checked to make sure I had the Lores. There seems to be a lot of negative changes with no rhyme or reason except to make the game harder to do the things we are used to already doing.
 

Teknique

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I just noticed this today too when I tamed the White Bear I failed multiple times and I thought I dropped lores or something for a minute I was confused. Did they actually change something in the fail area of taming?
Yeah, it was in the notes. made high level pets harder to tame
 
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Valoran

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It's intended to be very difficult if not impossible to tame a high level white bear, you're supposed to tame the bear while it's young and train it up so you have more of an investment in your pet.

The issue is I don't think it spawns young yet, so at the moment it's just harder to get than before which is indeed a small temporary balance fix to address how prevalent white bears have been in PvP.

That said, now we have prowers and campodons so it's not hugely significant..

I hope we can get some proper pet combat balance sooner rather than later.
 

ElPerro

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It's intended to be very difficult if not impossible to tame a high level white bear, you're supposed to tame the bear while it's young and train it up so you have more of an investment in your pet.

The issue is I don't think it spawns young yet, so at the moment it's just harder to get than before which is indeed a small temporary balance fix to address how prevalent white bears have been in PvP.

That said, now we have prowers and campodons so it's not hugely significant..

I hope we can get some proper pet combat balance sooner rather than later.
Id rather they actually balance pets instead of making them harder to get. Then kids will cry that their white bear cant solo a 10 man foot group because it took them hours to get....

They are following MO1 balance logic at this point, just like with Death Knights.
 
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Teknique

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Id rather they actually balance pets instead of making them harder to get. Then kids will cry that their white bear cant solo a 10 man foot group because it took them hours to get....

They are following MO1 balance logic at this point, just like with Death Knights.
exactly what I said.

Death knights were super hard to get, it doesn't mean a damn thing.

oh well I/we tried.
 
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Valoran

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Id rather they actually balance pets instead of making them harder to get. Then kids will cry that their white bear cant solo a 10 man foot group because it took them hours to get....

They are following MO1 balance logic at this point, just like with Death Knights.
Henrik has said many times now that they are going to change the way pet combat works, this is just one part of the coming balance.

Making something harder to get is a good balance tweak, although obviously not sufficient on its own.
 

Tzone

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Henrik has said many times now that they are going to change the way pet combat works, this is just one part of the coming balance.

Making something harder to get is a good balance tweak, although obviously not sufficient on its own.
Harder to get is meaningless balance. Its only serves to lessen frustration of players who are fighting these pets. Its basically moving to the side actual balance but limiting the problem so less people have bad gameplay experience.
 
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PoisonArrows

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It's intended to be very difficult if not impossible to tame a high level white bear, you're supposed to tame the bear while it's young and train it up so you have more of an investment in your pet.

The issue is I don't think it spawns young yet, so at the moment it's just harder to get than before which is indeed a small temporary balance fix to address how prevalent white bears have been in PvP.

That said, now we have prowers and campodons so it's not hugely significant..

I hope we can get some proper pet combat balance sooner rather than later.
There is a area to tame young level white bears. But Breeding isn't in the game yet, so taming something low level doesn't exactly have much purpose at the moment.
 

PoisonArrows

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Harder to get is meaningless balance. Its only serves to lessen frustration of players who are fighting these pets. Its basically moving to the side actual balance but limiting the problem so less people have bad gameplay experience.
It doesn't even really affect the people fighting them. I've already resupplied my stock, and once release happens I can just breed these or any other pet. The people this affects is the tamers/dominators themselves it just makes getting the bear more annoying for us.
 

PoisonArrows

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Don't let me derail you, but just for my notes: I imagine that no-one's going to be Taming a Dragon or Troll? Those will Be candidates for Domination? (And, I have to imagine, the difficulty will be systematically different?)
You are correct it will be domination for Dragons/Trolls however the process is the same stand there and wait for RNG to work. And because it took so many tries for the White bear, I was just thinking how annoying it would be when you are about to Dominate a Dragon that only spawns once and then you die because dominate Rng failed you and then the dragon one shots you. It will probably 1 shot every member of your team making you have to have a lot of people as sacrifices.


And ya know I was really thinking about the dominating of the troll while taming the White Bear, because Henric said it will take a special build to get a troll, which leads me to believe there will be other primary skills to support the domination skill or skills for trolls specifically.

Oh more specifics I believe Dragon magic is what controls dragons and not Taming/Domination. If it has the same Rng as these other 2 skills we will see in the future.
 
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PoisonArrows

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Henrik has said many times now that they are going to change the way pet combat works, this is just one part of the coming balance.

Making something harder to get is a good balance tweak, although obviously not sufficient on its own.
But then one has to wonder if it takes Skill to make your future pets attack, then can't I just manually do Charge attacks? In that case I'll actually deal more damage manually then the current system, as heavy pets are going to be designed to not be blockable xD So us Beast Masters win again.
 

PoisonArrows

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Id rather they actually balance pets instead of making them harder to get. Then kids will cry that their white bear cant solo a 10 man foot group because it took them hours to get....

They are following MO1 balance logic at this point, just like with Death Knights.
They were imbalanced against Foot Fighters because foot fighters is weakest class in game. Anyone can beat a Foot Fighter, but anything mounted can beat pets. That's why the pet hate never made sense if you are on ground you are dead, if you are on mount we the beast masters are dead because Pets are balanced with speed, because they are never faster then a horse.
 
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PoisonArrows

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Balance = less chance on a dice roll... good balance indeed. Big Fan, love it! White bears are now officially fixxed and balanced, move on to boats now thx.
Hold my Beer, I want Wagons too son. Wagons and Boats.
 

Jatix

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I'm all for white bears not being op but as usual this wasnt the right solution. This is the same thing they did with broken ass DK's in MO1.

MO1 history for anyone who wasn't there: Add DK. DK are game breaking. Decides to nerf DK. Makes it so you cant level it in the equerry, to make it more grindy. Is still got tier with the right recipe and max level. If it ever got nerfed, it weasnt enough to care.

What they should have done. Make DK less broken. Dont change how you level it.

For some reason instead of making pets not broken, they want to keep them broken, but make them more effort to try and make it more justifiable how OP it is. But thats not fun. When you get zerged and ur pet dies, you lost more. and when someone gets fisted by the op pet, they say "its fair because I had to put al ot of effort into the pet". The complete wrong direction to balance it.
 

Valoran

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I'm all for white bears not being op but as usual this wasnt the right solution. This is the same thing they did with broken ass DK's in MO1.

MO1 history for anyone who wasn't there: Add DK. DK are game breaking. Decides to nerf DK. Makes it so you cant level it in the equerry, to make it more grindy. Is still got tier with the right recipe and max level. If it ever got nerfed, it weasnt enough to care.

What they should have done. Make DK less broken. Dont change how you level it.

For some reason instead of making pets not broken, they want to keep them broken, but make them more effort to try and make it more justifiable how OP it is. But thats not fun. When you get zerged and ur pet dies, you lost more. and when someone gets fisted by the op pet, they say "its fair because I had to put al ot of effort into the pet". The complete wrong direction to balance it.
Of course I agree that making something harder to get is not enough to make something balanced, but it is a huge factor and does contribute to whether or not something is balanced.

Take oghmium for example, an set of oghmium armor has almost 100% pierce and slash resistance, and is balanced by it taking a long time to make along with having simple counters such as magic and if you're on foot, stamina management.

If everyone could buy oghmium from a vendor it would be extremely broken compared to now, with the only difference there being ease of access.


When the only way to obtain a white bear or any strong pet is to tame it while young and train it up, they will be used less frequently and it will take longer to get them to a usable state.

Combine this with the coming pet combat changes and it might be balanced, but its obviously not done yet.
 
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Valoran

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But then one has to wonder if it takes Skill to make your future pets attack, then can't I just manually do Charge attacks? In that case I'll actually deal more damage manually then the current system, as heavy pets are going to be designed to not be blockable xD So us Beast Masters win again.
They've thrown around the idea of making each attack type have a cooldown if they don't go for pet stamina, so you won't be able to spam heavy attacks.