New way to progress skills in MO2

[Kelzyr]

A. tasks is just a less fancy word for quests. I mean it is literally the same thing.

B. Once the "new" players runs out of "tasks" they will ask for more and still quit because they "finished" the game.

C. These "task" chains would be a lot of work to do proper. Looking at the past I am not optimistic SV can do it in the time that is left. And we do need a skill up system at release that works WELL. Not a broken chain of "not-a-quest".

D. I didn´t like the "tasks" (egg delivery) in the first game very much either. They were static and unrealistic for the most part. I would rather see them replaced with something else than more of them.


In the end it´s just the opposite of the sandbox idea. It´s literally a themepark. Adding it in parallel would eat up delelopment costs for a shitty questline instead of improving the actual game play. It´s another example where people can´t see the benefit of having one character per account to the original design.

I do miss the old days where I would have had support against quest ideas, but I guess times have changed.

I'll agree with you fully that my main concern with my suggestion is that it may be too much of an undertaking for the development team.

I probably have my head too far in the clouds thinking that this would be something that wouldn't be botched. Its definitely hard to fully explain my idea of 'quests' for everyone to understand but it would be nothing like typical themepark MMOs which require no thought. I think my original post saying they would be akin to Everquest's way of adding quests is as close as I can get to explaining them.

I agree that they are making good changes by only having one character per account because yes as long as you don't re-roll your character because it's not the right race or age then you would only need to do the grind one time.

I have literally just explained it in my post. If experience gain is tied to damage done etc. macroing will be less effective. Maybe a number will clear this up for you:

Macro: Doing 0,1 damage per second with a wooden sword - 0,1 experience gain per second.
Fighting walkers: Doing 10 damage per second (bigger hits split by seconds) - 10 experience gain per second.

One skill point from 0-10 = 100 exp. Macro: 1000 seconds Fightin walkers: 10 seconds + gold + actual gameplay

You can adjust the number to your liking.

This would be a good change to the current system that would not be that hard to implement.

I guess at the end of the day I find the idea of running around interacting with the NPCs getting a little Myrland lore, some riddles, some vague dialog, to lead to an inevitable quest/task is much more entertaining gameplay than simply going out and killing some pigs or walkers for a few hours for not much reason more than to level your skill up as fast as possible.

The current skill system isn't going to stop me from playing the game. If they tweak it for the better without this suggestion I'll be happy, but I'll still be bored until I've skilled my character to near max level.

 

[Eldrath]

I'll agree with you fully that my main concern with my suggestion is that it may be too much of an undertaking for the development team.

I probably have my head too far in the clouds thinking that this would be something that wouldn't be botched. Its definitely hard to fully explain my idea of 'quests' for everyone to understand but it would be nothing like typical themepark MMOs which require no thought. I think my original post saying they would be akin to Everquest's way of adding quests is as close as I can get to explaining them.

I agree that they are making good changes by only having one character per account because yes as long as you don't re-roll your character because it's not the right race or age then you would only need to do the grind one time.



This would be a good change to the current system that would not be that hard to implement.

I guess at the end of the day I find the idea of running around interacting with the NPCs getting a little Myrland lore, some riddles, some vague dialog, to lead to an inevitable quest/task is much more entertaining gameplay than simply going out and killing some pigs or walkers for a few hours for not much reason more than to level your skill up as fast as possible.

The current skill system isn't going to stop me from playing the game. If they tweak it for the better without this suggestion I'll be happy, but I'll still be bored until I've skilled my character to near max level.

I feel you when it comes to lore. Sadly what we have gotten over the years was little and badly executed for the most part. That is what I expect if SV were to try to implement your idea. I don´t think they even have a full time writer on their team. So it would be anintern and Herius making some stuff up with a few references to the texts on the homepage. Since neither of them understands advanced swedish the real meat of the lore wouldn´t come close to the whole process. Good writing is actually hard to come by and for that reason is revered by gamers. Most games have shit writing.

Our only hope for proper lore implementation is that MO2 launch creates enough cash flow for Henrik to get Mat back full time. Or at least a proper writer and game designer.

Now that being said. The good thing about a sandbox is that you can do without very much writing since the players will create the narrative for you. If you personally lack a narrative, create one. It´s fun. If you stop looking at the game from a purely technical standpoint you will find your experience much improved.


Riddles are a good idea and MO1 has some. Them doubling down on that kind of lore would be nice. For that to happen you don´t need any task system but good writing, good artist etc.

 

[MolagAmur]

I hate quests and I'm happy MO1 had no real quests (NPC's that asks for certain goods for trade is the closest thing to a quest, expect the tutorial).
I don't want to run from Tindr. to Fab. to Meduli or whatsoever just in order to gain skill points.

In MO1 players used a lot of macros cause they needed to do the whole level up for a lot of their characters.
I would say most players in MO1 level their first character up without a macro.
In MO2 you got only one character. Leveling that one character up is endurable.

Skill system should be reworked that the "quality" of the task matters for the experience, and not only the quantity.
Crafting a metal sword should gain more XP than crafting a wooden stick.
Fighting PVE should gain more XP than hitting a dummy for 0 damage with a wooden stick.

If you actually think 99% of people who want to be competitive won't macro their characters while they are sleeping until their character is maxed youre kidding yourself. I know I will be.

Also you're guys suggestion of the skill xp being dependent on damage just replaces macroing with finding a mob with high hp and low damage to grind your skill up on. It just replaces macros with spending hours killing the same mob over and over. I won't argue for which one is more appealing...because they both suck...but I don't think traveling Nave and talking to NPCs and doing tasks for them is any worse than that. If anything it actually gets people out in the world moving around.

I know a lot of you remember having to always go ALL the way to Toxai to get books. Or ALL the way to GK to buy passive regen. Its kinda the same idea. It gets people out and about doing things instead of cheesing skills up.

I don't care either way how we do it. But you can't sit here and bash Kelzyrs ideas and say you hate quests when the alternative is arguably worse. They aren't forced quests...there are other ways to accomplish the same goal. But yeah. Whatever way works for me.

 

[Teknique]

Yeah and its prob best just left the way things are.

All jokes aside, reaching "max level" in two days in a game with only 1 character might not be great slave design, but i'd rather the grind be for mats and gold, land, keeps, tears, and souls.

 

[Amelia]

I like your idea, maybe a mix of missions and books to reach lev. 100

 

[Xunila]

It's all a matter of required time to reach maximum skill level in agility and fighting and crafting skills. There is the difference between stupid macroing and just learning by doing while playing the game. If the agility skills would be maxed after some hours of playing while running to all tutors in Haven, then running to the guy who moves you to Myrland, and then running around in the area of your chosen starter city, nobody would macro this skills. Then you usually start to gather stuff or fight undeads or bandits to get your first gold coins, you fighting skills could be nearly maxed after another few hours.

Sorry, but MO is not a game to fight with maxed skills ten minutes after start. Most time has to be spend to get the gear and prepare for fights. This could take weeks. And we have a single character system, so skilling up is done once, because nobody changes the weapon group skills all some days.

 

[Eldrath]

@MolagAmur and @Teknique
I think you should stick to giving feedback on swing arcs and timings. Your contribution to this topic was basically: I want to play a shooter with resources - not a RPG. So please keep a shitty system I can exploit. It´s a bit embarrasing.

It's all a matter of required time to reach maximum skill level in agility and fighting and crafting skills. There is the difference between stupid macroing and just learning by doing while playing the game. If the agility skills would be maxed after some hours of playing while running to all tutors in Haven, then running to the guy who moves you to Myrland, and then running around in the area of your chosen starter city, nobody would macro this skills. Then you usually start to gather stuff or fight undeads or bandits to get your first gold coins, you fighting skills could be nearly maxed after another few hours.

Sorry, but MO is not a game to fight with maxed skills ten minutes after start. Most time has to be spend to get the gear and prepare for fights. This could take weeks. And we have a single character system, so skilling up is done once, because nobody changes the weapon group skills all some days.

That´s a good idea. By making different skills level up at different speeds it´s creating a sense of archivement.

 

[Teknique]

@MolagAmur and @Teknique
I think you should stick to giving feedback on swing arcs and timings. Your contribution to this topic was basically: I want to play a shooter with resources - not a RPG. So please keep a shitty system I can exploit. It´s a bit embarrasing.



That´s a good idea. By making different skills level up at different speeds it´s creating a sense of archivement.

Well my contribution to the thread has been about one and a half posts or maybe 4 sentences. I think your mad is showing. I’ve never liked grinding. Sorry. If it’s grinding wealth that’s fine. I think umm it was a key feature of mo the quick leveling. Maybe you should play something else since you don’t seem to like mortal?

 

[Eldrath]

Well my contribution to the thread has been about one and a half posts or maybe 4 sentences. I think your mad is showing. I’ve never liked grinding. Sorry. If it’s grinding wealth that’s fine. I think umm it was a key feature of mo the quick leveling. Maybe you should play something else since you don’t seem to like mortal?

A key feature of Mortal was leveling skills by using them and being able to switch professions by using the associated skills. The speed of that actually changed quite a lot over the years. The mechanic stayed the same.

Another key feature was the lack of quests, which later on got diluted with some weird and badly executed additions.

Since I was actually proposing a change that would increase the leveling speed, thus enhancing the key features of Mortal I think you are out of your league here. I am arguing against implementing something that does not go well with original vision and takes dev time that I rather have them spend on useful additions.

You don´t like grind? How about you play games with zero grind then instead of complaining about the tiny amount of grind it would be to kill 40 walkers to max out a weapon skill? Or macro if it´s too much to ask for you to actually play the game so you can get to whatever it is you think you will archive.

 

[Teknique]

A key feature of Mortal was leveling skills by using them and being able to switch professions by using the associated skills. The speed of that actually changed quite a lot over the years. The mechanic stayed the same.

Another key feature was the lack of quests, which later on got diluted with some weird and badly executed additions.

Since I was actually proposing a change that would increase the leveling speed, thus enhancing the key features of Mortal I think you are out of your league here. I am arguing against implementing something that does not go well with original vision and takes dev time that I rather have them spend on useful additions.

You don´t like grind? How about you play games with zero grind then instead of complaining about the tiny amount of grind it would be to kill 40 walkers to max out a weapon skill? Or macro if it´s too much to ask for you to actually play the game so you can get to whatever it is you think you will archive.

Ok then if we both think the leveling should be quick what’s the problem?

I think we can ACHIEVE some common ground here.

I couldn’t care less if it’s killing 40 walkers or macroing I just don’t want it to be grindy

 

[Kelzyr]

I couldn’t care less if it’s killing 40 walkers or macroing I just don’t want it to be grindy

Its hard to make something 'not grindy' because everyone's definition of grindy is different, but on the whole I agree with you. I don't wanna play BDO where I have to sit at the same mob spawn for 6 days just to get one level XD

 

[Eldrath]

Actually with my suggestions dueling would be a viable way of leveling combat skills. Provided you have enough food to compensate for the reserve loss. But I guess dueling is too grindy. Oh wait.

 

[Kelzyr]

Actually with my suggestions dueling would be a viable way of leveling combat skills. Provided you have enough food to compensate for the reserve loss. But I guess dueling is too grindy. Oh wait.

I think you're arguing with yourself, I'm not sure many people really disagree that much with you dude.

 

[Tergeo]

Thread cleaned. Keep it on topic and without so much arguing, or it will be locked. Start to focus on leaving your feedback for the Developers to read and less on fighting.

 

[Geedorah]

I think this would work much better for more esoteric skills such as weapon crafting, and not necessarily with skills such as athletics. You can develop good athletic skills by simply practicing them, but learning how to forge an axe is something you'll have to be taught. The same would go for magic, combat skills, alchemy etc.