Haven and Keeps

[LoPing]

During the launch and patch cycle a few people made the claim that two guilds were cheating and building Keeps for a so called unfair advantage. This was looked into by the devs and they found some claims to be true. They didn't call anyone out or impose a ban. What they did do was drop the amount of gold a player could take out of haven.( I disagree with this action) and also required two clade gifts to leave haven. ( I agree with this action it was the right fix). What I hope not to see is a never ending string of nerfs to make the game fair and balanced to some people. The reason mankind is the apex predator on the planet is the ability to think outside the box, to solve the puzzle problems. As for the guilds they applied a course of action to the problem and used teamwork to achieve the goal. Keeps. This did not break any code of conduct or rule. It was cleaver and unexpected thinking. Nerfing to combat unexpected thinking is wrong. No one promised constant monitoring to make a event fair or balanced and I don't want to spend time in some adult daycare type theme park. Housing is an asset that must be earned but it also something that has to be protected and maintained.
I think housing it too cheap in the game and would have no problem with a house starting at 500 gold and the basic keep at 1000 if they would return the haven gold cap to beta standard of 10 gold. Also keep the clade gift requirement of 2 gifts to leave haven. There is a Chinese curse that goes- may you live in exciting times. This is my wish for everyone, we have exciting times and not put to sleep by over protective dev's. So go on and flame me.

 

[Tzone]

They should have just locked keeps. IDK why they would not. Its launch and going to be rough. Even just a 1 week hold on buying keep deeds would have been great.

 

[Jackdstripper]

SV was told well in advance by most guilds that the Haven gold issue was going to be exploited. They did nothing, until they changed their mind 24 hours in and decided to change it.

some guilds are swimming in gold and SV isnt deleting it. Thats how the first keep was built btw, farming Haven.

same old SV as usual.

 

[Deleted member 44]

SV has allowed keeps to be claimed without any mechanics to tear them down. Zerg guilds have all the advantage right now as their sheer numbers create an advantage to gold collection. We had the server alliance take the GK keep. We wiped their group but were unable to do anything to the keep as the doors shut at 30% securing victory for the server alliance despite them being the inferior fighting force. I wasn't even able to play during the fight due to the server issues locking me out of playing the game.

 

[Jackdstripper]

The numbers thing isnt even a consideration. You cant cap guilds numbers, or coalitions in an open world mmo. Numbers will always have an advantage.

the sheer volume of gold farmable in Haven( in first 24 hours), and the fact that you can place a keep but cant siege or destroy it is complete bs. That i agree with. Keeps shouldnt haven been implemented until way down the toad.

 

[Nefnate]

Big guilds are good for the game (from a numbers / active players PoV), as groups tend to stick together. So a group of 100+ in a guild is more likely to remain stable as population &, if one or more of these guilds got to carve out their Keep early, they'd be even more likely to stay. Curious to think about.

I am of the mind that previously, keeps should have been locked at the start, and currently that any guild who farmed gold from the Haven loop should have the gold or deed taken from them.

 

[Vulpin]

The muling as many people keep calling it (process of spamming alt to mass move gold an matz from heaven) is clearly players exploiting mechanics. If it wasn't SV should have never introduced the cap on transferring items from Heaven. I personally haven't partaken in this exploit, but member I plan to guild with have. My concern is if SV can't find a mechanical way to stop people from abusing this system than they'll either delete it or start issuing bans to people clearly exploiting it.

As for keeps, strongholds, and houses this system should of been disabled until sieging was implemented. It basically turned owning these structures is just who placed their blueprint first owns the keep for the foreseeable future. This was just poor planning on SV side.

 

[Eldrath]

I disagree with this action) and also required two clade gifts to leave haven. ( I agree with this action it was the right fix).

I disagree. Forcing someone to stay in a tutorial area to mindlessly kill walkers or bandits when they could be in the real game interacting with players is a poor solution. There is no way to have the "haven concept" (instances with limited farming that allow transfer of items) and have it not impact the real game in some way.

Haven was bad concept from the start and should have never been implemented. There are other ways to teach players about the game that would never have had these problems.

Obviously I realize that SV does not have the resources to rework their tutorial and now they will have to push bad solutions like in the hotfix.

 

[Tzone]

They should just wipe and start over. Just dont let anyone take anything from haven. Whats the difference between 3 gold and zero?

Bandits in haven only give 4 clade while zombies are so much easier and give the same clade exp. Need to buff clade exp for bandits in haven at the least.

Kinda a disaster now.

 

[Jackdstripper]

its pretty simple. You shouldnt be allowed to bring anything from Haven. You can learn the game. You can buy your books and read them. You can get a couple clades. And thats it.

no gold, no books, no items( except starter sword).

SV was told this months ago. They just dont give a crap about people exploiting.

 

[Tzone]

its pretty simple. You shouldnt be allowed to bring anything from Haven. You can learn the game. You can buy your books and read them. You can get a couple clades. And thats it.

no gold, no books, no items( except starter sword).

SV was told this months ago. They just dont give a crap about people exploiting.

I would be fine if they got rid of the starter sword too. That thing is pretty OP and can hit people for 50s on some builds. Maybe just unsoul bind it after you leave haven.

 

[Vulpin]

I disagree. Forcing someone to stay in a tutorial area to mindlessly kill walkers or bandits when they could be in the real game interacting with players is a poor solution. There is no way to have the "haven concept" (instances with limited farming that allow transfer of items) and have it not impact the real game in some way.

Haven was bad concept from the start and should have never been implemented. There are other ways to teach players about the game that would never have had these problems.

Obviously I realize that SV does not have the resources to rework their tutorial and now they will have to push bad solutions like in the hotfix.

Personally I think Haven is fine an a great system to allow new players to learn the basics without the constant worry of being killed the entire time while still learning. The issue with Haven is the resource transfer mechanic, it created the issue we see now were people are mass transferring gold an matz from Haven an how it greatly affecting the main land far more than SV wanted it to.

As for the tutorial it self yes it dogshit it basically tells you nothing, but forcing new players into the main world won't suddenly make it easier for new players to learn how to play. If anything it will just frustrate new players because they'll go to test something or feature out a mechanic but than someone will come up to them an murder them. To me there nothing more annoying than dying to someone while I was trying to learn an or test something.

 

[Emdash]

The reason mankind is the apex predator on the planet is the ability to think outside the box.

It was cleaver and unexpected thinking.

Apexing Mortal? Clever and unexpected thinking? More like hardcore ho-ing lol. Akin to farming behind walls. It's the absence of pvp that makes it an exploit. It's apex bitchmade.

Edit: and yea I'll admit I took useful stuff with me from Haven, but it's like putting on a fake beard n glasses to go back to a buy one get one free sale (one per person.) Apex. haha. Stealing napkins from McDonalds. Apex.

I spawned into Myr to start farming solo for the gold to put down a guild stone, expecting pvp, there was none. What those(you?) guys did... was soft. lol.

I would still be doing it if I could get into the game. I left Haven early to give nubs space, hard handicapping myself and locking myself out of the game. Now I WISH I could get back so I could play the game a little.

Your logic tho, I mean, it trolls itself. You are like a psychopath w/ o any means. Someone who can't do it in real life so you try to do it on games. And yea sorry to break character, but what you said is so unbelievably foul and lacking in perspective that it deserves a 100% real response.

Watch out, bud, you're slipping off the edge of any sort of ethics and you're doing it on Mortal Online Forums. That's a bad loooook.

 

[LoPing]

Apexing Mortal? Clever and unexpected thinking? More like hardcore ho-ing lol. Akin to farming behind walls. It's the absence of pvp that makes it an exploit. It's apex bitchmade.

Edit: and yea I'll admit I took useful stuff with me from Haven, but it's like putting on a fake beard n glasses to go back to a buy one get one free sale (one per person.) Apex. haha. Stealing napkins from McDonalds. Apex.

I spawned into Myr to start farming solo for the gold to put down a guild stone, expecting pvp, there was none. What those(you?) guys did... was soft. lol.

I would still be doing it if I could get into the game. I left Haven early to give nubs space, hard handicapping myself and locking myself out of the game. Now I WISH I could get back so I could play the game a little.

Your logic tho, I mean, it trolls itself. You are like a psychopath w/ o any means. Someone who can't do it in real life so you try to do it on games. And yea sorry to break character, but what you said is so unbelievably foul and lacking in perspective that it deserves a 100% real response.

Watch out, bud, you're slipping off the edge of any sort of ethics and you're doing it on Mortal Online Forums. That's a bad loooook.

glad I offended you, I am a psychopath? you must think everything in life should be handed to you. All in all thanks for your honesty, enjoy the short time you will be in Mo2

 

[Emdash]

glad I offended you, I am a psychopath? you must think everything in life should be handed to you. All in all thanks for your honesty, enjoy the short time you will be in Mo2

pm me lol

 

[Eldrath]

Personally I think Haven is fine an a great system to allow new players to learn the basics without the constant worry of being killed the entire time while still learning. The issue with Haven is the resource transfer mechanic, it created the issue we see now were people are mass transferring gold an matz from Haven an how it greatly affecting the main land far more than SV wanted it to.

As for the tutorial it self yes it dogshit it basically tells you nothing, but forcing new players into the main world won't suddenly make it easier for new players to learn how to play. If anything it will just frustrate new players because they'll go to test something or feature out a mechanic but than someone will come up to them an murder them. To me there nothing more annoying than dying to someone while I was trying to learn an or test something.

If you are new and SV does their job you will be testing systems and features for years to come. All with the constant thread of being attacked.

Part of testing crafting is building up materials and using those to make different crafts. Any part of the game that lets you not transfer those items essentially hinders your progress. Not sure what other features require a long drawn disabling of PvP unless you are just not into the whole concept. If you are researching a new potion and are about to collect a new incredient you are supposed to be in danger.

A context based tutorial in Myrland that intentially spreads the new players out would have been a less work intensive and more immersive. If you are talking about learning which icons to click to extract and how to loot, how to swing a weapon ... I mean it´s fairly obvious to anyone who played similar games. But I guess you could have a training field type instances that you can go back to any time to ... click stuff, fight walkers and rehearse those processes to your hearts content.

 

[Exiledkhallisi]

All they have to do is remove the current and obviously exploited keeps.

Make Haven completely solidary. Nothing comes to Nave.

Problem solved

 

[Yeonan]

"We've learnt alot"tm

 

[Bardif]

They should have just locked keeps. IDK why they would not. Its launch and going to be rough. Even just a 1 week hold on buying keep deeds would have been great.

Exactly.

 

[Teknique]

SV has allowed keeps to be claimed without any mechanics to tear them down. Zerg guilds have all the advantage right now as their sheer numbers create an advantage to gold collection. We had the server alliance take the GK keep. We wiped their group but were unable to do anything to the keep as the doors shut at 30% securing victory for the server alliance despite them being the inferior fighting force. I wasn't even able to play during the fight due to the server issues locking me out of playing the game.

You didn't wipe shit you got wiped.

and you had more tags there than we did.