He played 500 hours it’s not that weird if he’s gained some game knowledge.
id put that on Jeff’s angelic voice
Final Thoughts - A new and departing player
- Thread starter Dazin
- Start date
id put that on Jeff’s angelic voice
Agreed the nail in the coffin is usually when you realize that even though the game could be great in 6 months, SVs unwillingness to make any changes from MO1 will ultimately be its downfall. They just flat out refuse to try something new. They will spend the next two years copying over content from MO1
500 hours is about the amount of time you need to experience mostly everything in this game and really be able to see both its good and bad. I think the review is extremely accurate.
I should have quoted 1.0 as well. That's the thing, man. Terminology isn't based that way. haha. That's where people are fucking up, and in some way some people give SV a pass. 1+ is NOT ALPHA. It's not even BETA. This is "open beta" level content, but the game is released and they played themselves ultrahard not doing that because imagine if they realized their problem before release, and got flack for it, and had a chance, etc...
I gotta say I'm not super into kick start lvl games, but I've played a few of them in alpha and beta. This is a lot more polished than some of them, and some of them never make it. Still, beta is the best you can say. Wonky beta. But, again, doesn't matter what it is like... it's released. The second release is gonna be the sub, and it's funny they teased about the sub. They should have said it in a way that made it seem like the sub was far away because they had more work to do (be humble!), instead, tonally they made it seem like they are aiming to start sub asap. Which is prol true, but... we're aiming to play da gam asap too?
At Stril's eye, I dono. My head hurts from forum psychoanalysis. Dazi def knew the game a good amount imo. I don't recall them making epic nubby question posts, but I am not gonna comb their search history.
I'm more of the camp doesn't matter. lol. I dunno why someone would even play that, unless they are like a banned boy.
Look there’s no reason for me to bs about anything….my forum name is the same as my character name and anyone who ever dueled me or tried to teach me about combat could attest to how new I was heh. I never even heard of MO1 until I started playing MO2.
When I play a game I’m all in and want to be as capable as possible so of course that involves learning as much as I can about game design. I’m also an experienced MMO player so this isn’t my first rodeo and despite what some may think MO2 isn’t really unique at all when one considers all the titles that have came out the past several decades.
If I thought MO2 didn’t have potential, or had a strong player base that was continuing to grow, I wouldn’t have bothered to leave a review. However, I think how SV views their game in comparison to players is very misaligned and I don’t think MO2 is going to succeed unless SV starts being honest with themselves about the product they have put out and the changes that need to be made.
Think of my review simply as a way of saying thank you to SV for the opportunity to play in Nave and here is some feedback regarding some perceived flaws in MO2 as I also say goodbye. If they don’t care or bother to consider constructive criticism then that’s on them. Nothing more to say.
When I play a game I’m all in and want to be as capable as possible so of course that involves learning as much as I can about game design. I’m also an experienced MMO player so this isn’t my first rodeo and despite what some may think MO2 isn’t really unique at all when one considers all the titles that have came out the past several decades.
If I thought MO2 didn’t have potential, or had a strong player base that was continuing to grow, I wouldn’t have bothered to leave a review. However, I think how SV views their game in comparison to players is very misaligned and I don’t think MO2 is going to succeed unless SV starts being honest with themselves about the product they have put out and the changes that need to be made.
Think of my review simply as a way of saying thank you to SV for the opportunity to play in Nave and here is some feedback regarding some perceived flaws in MO2 as I also say goodbye. If they don’t care or bother to consider constructive criticism then that’s on them. Nothing more to say.
To be completely fair, I was responding to someone else who called the current version 'alpha'. I don't know whether they were being sardonic or not.
I would agree that the game might more accurately be called a beta state than alpha... But on the other hand, a lot of core skills & even clade gifts and points of interest etc. are not implemented, and by beta you usually at least have all of that groundworks stuff set in place and are balancing & fixing bugs/exploits. On one hand, we are there, but on the other hand a lot of it is also just placeholder... So it kind of defies a normal video game development process.
That's kind of part of the issue, I think. SV don't seem to be interested in implementing holistic mechanics before moving on to something else. They take the approach of implementing tons of placeholder and half finished stuff with the intent of fleshing them out 'soon'. So, in that sense it does kind of resemble an alpha for all the placeholder stuff, but on the other hand in terms of the amount of content & how bug fixing, balancing & polish is ongoing, it's definitely more like a beta.
But yeah, I was saying the same thing; we might call it 'beta' or 'alpha', but really the game is technically released... So... That makes it all kind of more confusing and to some extent theoretical/irrelevant. Technically, on paper, this is release, even if it didn't release in a completed form.
Last edited:
Yeah, I was agreeing. Strangely seems like more people are creeping back in. Get that 19. sale SV!!
For me this guy nailed it. I am talking 100% dead on. His take on doing dungeons is exactly how I feel.
Great example of which. My main character doesnt have spiritism, necromancy, doesnt craft with blood silk, iron fur, iron silk, or make draco plate or risar weapons. So there is ZERO point in me going in any of the dungeons other than act as cannon fodder or as a heal bot. Which would be fine if during PVP I was more than a heal bot also.
Then the ping issues... LOL "ping normalization...." my African American Ass.
If ping didnt matter Henrik make an alt server based in Colorado USA or in Sidney AUS? And have your precious EU players try melee with a quarter second ping.
Great example of which. My main character doesnt have spiritism, necromancy, doesnt craft with blood silk, iron fur, iron silk, or make draco plate or risar weapons. So there is ZERO point in me going in any of the dungeons other than act as cannon fodder or as a heal bot. Which would be fine if during PVP I was more than a heal bot also.
Then the ping issues... LOL "ping normalization...." my African American Ass.
If ping didnt matter Henrik make an alt server based in Colorado USA or in Sidney AUS? And have your precious EU players try melee with a quarter second ping.
Yeah, dungeons could be made more accessible for sure. No sane person is going to spend 10-20 minutes to travel to a dungeon just to get ganked by some dickhole and his 4 blue friends that keep jumping around trying to blue block you.
'It's group content', I guess... Then that's the issue with the entire game. Nothing is made accessible, and then they wonder why people don't want to play. What happens if you are in a guild that only has a few people active throughout the day, and often has nobody active except peak hours/weekends, or want to play solo? Guess you're locked out of 80% of the content, too bad.
Optional PvP factions could help accessibility-- so even if you aren't with a zerg guild/allies, you might run into some people in your faction & be allies. It would just create more options for people to cooperate & PvP instead of depending 100% on cliquey GvG systems, which, especially when pops start to dwindle, exclude tons and tons of people. It wouldn't even have to change the PvP dynamics much otherwise; you could still PK people on your own faction with penalties if you wanted, for example (maybe additional faction rep penalties if there are rewards). If you did include faction rewards to help people get decent trinkets & armor/weapons(nothing you can't get a bit better elsewhere) for PvP turn-ins, you also just created PvP content for 'end-game'. Ofc TC would still be necessary, but there is no conflict between the two. We already support people PKing constantly with blue flags, so it's not like this system could break the PK mechanics any more than they already are (if anything it would add another layer of obfuscation so that the whole blue bandit meta is felt less).
I also support the idea anabolic had about having random alternating dungeon turn-ins to create hotspots. That would at least help a little bit. It would create some sense of dynamic content, and also alleviate the pressure on the other dungeons during the turn-in period.
I guess all I'm saying is, there are ways to democratize the experience, and they should try to do that. The things that could democratize the PvP/PvE situation are also things that could create 'end-game' sandbox PvP&PvE content, which are currently lacking.
Last edited:
D
Dracu
Guest
Ping normalization once worked somewhat, but that was long ago. The combat got sped up actively destroying the normalisation they themselves implemented and advertised... Its such a shame it still gets used as a selling point long after they negated its effect... Cause to slow combat <.<
MO combat could be so good... lol. I mean I see it. I see good MO combat. There are so many ways they could do it, but none of them are things they are doing. They don't want spicy pvp, haha.
D
Dracu
Guest
Yeah... tbh... no idea how they want to make it great. the things henrik talked about with these special attacks are silly... like really silly... atleast if he plans to implement them as he described them early in alpha... like 2 years ago........... Unblockable attacks you have to dodge.... yeah... can imagine how well that will work... given... they screwed their ping normalisation... cant wait for dodges that are literally useless for high ping players.
It still makes me somewhat pissed... they HAD IT.... they literally had a somewhat fair combat symtem... sure it was slow... but they could have added the more skillfull stuff ontop... but nope just speed it up, ignore the impact on ping normalisation... just go with it... They could have made it something that really works. But they decided against it... speed up is the easy route.
If it worked better when combat was slower, why did they speed it up? How much slower was it?
I would be fine with slower combat if the infamous 'ping normalization' worked better. Was the slower combat causing issues or something?
D
Dracu
Guest
The slower combat created no technical issues in combat, it was changed after vocal complaints to make it faster.
Yes the ping normalisation... as it was intendet when it was implemented was a work around to make parrying attacks possible for higher ping players. I think it worked up to roughly 200 ping in a somewhat decent way.
What it did was, slow the attack speed down to that of a "high ping" player, giving higher ping players enough time to react.
It was pretty much pinpointed as slow as it needed to be afaik.
For the sake of giving a full picture:
What it does not do and thats where the ping advantage still existed, was on the blocking. Lower ping = more reaction time when parrying, thats still in aswell.
Also where an issue arrived is ofcourse that killing took longer, due to less damage in same amount of time. So Henrik came up with the idea of special attacks that come in to give more ways to attack in a fight. But that idea never got into the game and it was announced ages ago. But the combat got sped up and then not touched anymore.
I feel like longer fights wouldn't really be a bad thing. Did it cause balance issues or were people just like "I WANT GAME FAST SWING GO BRRRRR" and SV listened?
D
Dracu
Guest
It has its ups and downs, its for sure more accesible to more ppl with slower combat i would say and yeah it was pretty much like you describe.
I just saw this... yeah, I mean I understand why slow down is a problem for some people, but I wasn't here for combat alpha. I am not a PC main player, but I feel like I understand 'what it takes,' and it's pretty interesting, even now, but it's also trash. IMO the skill gap is decreased and if you can somehow parry everything, you will eventually win, more than likely.
They need a good change up attack, not something you gotta dodge, cuz after unblockable comes iframes and NO. There should AT LEAST be complex attacks like charge as x, go into this, can even make it something you have to have skill to execute (put it in place of the spin!) and they could cost increased stam so you can't just spam them, but one good hit can change a lot, esp to someone who thinks they are parrying everything.
But yea dodging is in the game, it works, unfort, you have to get close to people to fight unless you can barely tap their parry w/ your swing then hit them coming in. The dodging in close is forcing 0s and 2s. So all that shit is actually WELL BALANCED imo. It's just being held back by various things.
I like MA because it's laggy sometimes but at least I can do it. I wouldn't mind euro people having an advantage (afaik they already have a huge one haha,) if it made the game play better for everyone else. I'm not one of those mad at euro kids, but I do wanna be able to get a good fight USA v USA. It's wack that whatever they put on the combat system goes on to affect us, too. It's like the worst of both worlds, supposed to fix, stifles game, actually buffs or keeps it close to the same in terms of ping differences.