Character Limit.

[Rorry]

As a former MO1 guild leader I am thinking through whether I want to try to start a guild once MO2 is up and running. I keep coming back to how big of a hassle it will be to defend any sort of asset when each account will only have 1 character. In any guild that I have been in, most players leave a character or two logged off, ready to defend, and play in other parts of the world on other characters. It's hard to see how it's going to work out without that as it seems to take one and a half to two hours to walk just from Fab to GK, so running back, even horseback, from one side of the map to defend something on the other isn't likely to work very well.
I thought to put this in with the suggestion threads, but from what I gather the decision is already fixed. I put it here in order to see what others are thinking about it, maybe I have missed some info or am not considering all the angles.

 

[bubbles]

They added a 'home' priest mechanic in the most recent patch. You get the option to go home priest next to nearest priest in the ghost thingy. I think that solves the base defence issue you're talking about

 

[KermyWormy]

Your enemies will have the same challenge.

 

[FreeHorses]

I just want 2 fatmages.

 

[Eldrath]

It emphasizes the importance of local conflicts and reduces the likelyhood of server wars. Both good things IMO.

Other things change as well that make expedition easier. Imagine only having to go to MK with 4 mates, taking gold, buying materials and you can craft everthing you need for the risar dungeon? Having crafting skills on your character at all times can be helpful in so many ways.

We don´t know anything about the siege mechanics at this point.

Personally I think the advantages of having one character outweight the problems.

 

[Keurk]

i guess the poor guy that is left on the keep walls while his buddies are farming somewhere else on the map will now be able to ask for some money for being THE WATCHER ^^

 

[ThaBadMan]

I think its good, aggressors is gonna go all in from the beginning when sieging.

Or when thinking about it, it might become ninja sieging on steroids, cause if you lose the fight over the keep gonna be half a day until your back in numbers.

 

[Rorry]

They added a 'home' priest mechanic in the most recent patch. You get the option to go home priest next to nearest priest in the ghost thingy. I think that solves the base defence issue you're talking about

Of course I know they added this, but it doesn't solve anything. Your force will be dropping everything when they die, ghosting from all around the map, resurrecting naked, and trying to gear up and prepare to defend. It will be a hectic nightmare for one, and for another will cause every guild to have to build multiple layers of walls or whatever form of defense becomes the best choice around the priest and bank.

Your enemies will have the same challenge.

Not precisely. The defender will always have the challenge, so a successful first strike will remove it.

It emphasizes the importance of local conflicts and reduces the likelyhood of server wars. Both good things IMO.

Other things change as well that make expedition easier. Imagine only having to go to MK with 4 mates, taking gold, buying materials and you can craft everthing you need for the risar dungeon? Having crafting skills on your character at all times can be helpful in so many ways.

We don´t know anything about the siege mechanics at this point.

Personally I think the advantages of having one character outweight the problems.

I agree that local conflicts will be more likely, but unless resources and dungeons are placed in each region to where no one ever travels far to hunt or harvest the regionality of a conflict won't help with this problem, may even exacerbate it, because your enemy won't have far to travel and you will have less chance to see a siege force coming.

Having crafting on your character is a mixed bag of pro's and con's. Sure you will carry the skill with you where ever you go, but how many fights will you have to turn down to save your reputation so that you can access your materials in a town controlled by a guild? Also, what are you going to do if you are across the world at a dungeon and some of your guild members need to have gear crafted and you are the one who has leveled up the correct skills?

I suspect that there will be a severe shortage of some of the less often needed skills.

I think its good, aggressors is gonna go all in from the beginning when sieging.

Or when thinking about it, it might become ninja sieging on steroids, cause if you lose the fight over the keep gonna be half a day until your back in numbers.

No one will aim for the keep first, just open up access to the priests and then you can take the keep at your leisure.
I haven't heard any plans from SV to curb ninja siegeing, so It will be a factor again.

 

[Eldrath]

Of course I know they added this, but it doesn't solve anything. Your force will be dropping everything when they die, ghosting from all around the map, resurrecting naked, and trying to gear up and prepare to defend. It will be a hectic nightmare for one, and for another will cause every guild to have to build multiple layers of walls or whatever form of defense becomes the best choice around the priest and bank.

According to Henrik walls will be very limited.

Not precisely. The defender will always have the challenge, so a successful first strike will remove it.

It depends on who you are fighting.

I agree that local conflicts will be more likely, but unless resources and dungeons are placed in each region to where no one ever travels far to hunt or harvest the regionality of a conflict won't help with this problem, may even exacerbate it, because your enemy won't have far to travel and you will have less chance to see a siege force coming.

I mean, you don´t really control a region if someone can prepare and pull off a siege without your knowledge. If you are in a very small guild then you would probably be well advised to band together with other small guilds who will help you in case of a siege. I think it will provide a challenge. But then having assets in a full loot game should be challenge and require player interaction to keep them standing.

Having crafting on your character is a mixed bag of pro's and con's. Sure you will carry the skill with you where ever you go, but how many fights will you have to turn down to save your reputation so that you can access your materials in a town controlled by a guild? Also, what are you going to do if you are across the world at a dungeon and some of your guild members need to have gear crafted and you are the one who has leveled up the correct skills?

Agreed. The force with a better organisation will always have the upper hand.

I hope they will do a good job with the flagging system. Obviously it would terrible if they went back to people having to watch how many kills they get in a fight. An easy solution would be to not have flagging in the wild. Sadly it feels that they are too afraid to go that far.

I suspect that there will be a severe shortage of some of the less often needed skills.

That would make those players then very sought after. IMO that´s good dynamic.

 

[Rorry]

Preparing and pulling off a siege without the target knowing is very common in MO1. Surprise and ninja sieges are the norm. Why won't MO2 be the same? How is territory control going to be different?

Making play types sought after is one thing, but having them be so rare that a guild leader has to play that type in order to have a guild is something else all together.
Engineering, for instance. It works in MO because many people had enough characters that they could throw a few hundred points on with something else, however back when you had to have many different skills to build all the different parts and workbenches, it was practically impossible to find someone to build something, so you would end up making a new character. Now, with only 1 character no one is going to have the extra points for something like engineering, so instead of simply buying a 9 dollar character slot, a guild leader will have to create a new steam account, repurchase the game, plus pay for another subscription just to fill in each of these skill gaps that will occur. Potentially I would need 1 for weapons, 1 for armor, 1 for extraction, engineering, etc. It is naive to think that you will be able to always find someone to craft or etc. for you.

 

[Xunila]

In the current version of MO2 the second skill window with crafting skills has a maximum of 1100 primary points. I don't know if you played or followed MO1 during the last two years: StarVault changed a number of former primary skills to secondary, e.g mining and woodcutting but also some material skills. With this changes most crafters got 200 to 500 free primary points (I think I had a crafter with 400 or 500 more points). Many crafters have been able to learn more and other crafting skills.

In MO2 the crafting system has been changed in a way that you can craft the best-most weapon/armor/... with just 70 primary points. You need 100 points only for some addition features like naming the item but not to make the item better. Means there is no restriction to a one crafting profession only like in MO1. Every crafter will be able to learn two or three professions.

And of cause StarVault could increase the number of primary points for crafting e.g. to 2000.

 

[Rorry]

In the current version of MO2 the second skill window with crafting skills has a maximum of 1100 primary points. I don't know if you played or followed MO1 during the last two years: StarVault changed a number of former primary skills to secondary, e.g mining and woodcutting but also some material skills. With this changes most crafters got 200 to 500 free primary points (I think I had a crafter with 400 or 500 more points). Many crafters have been able to learn more and other crafting skills.

In MO2 the crafting system has been changed in a way that you can craft the best-most weapon/armor/... with just 70 primary points. You need 100 points only for some addition features like naming the item but not to make the item better. Means there is no restriction to a one crafting profession only like in MO1. Every crafter will be able to learn two or three professions.

And of cause StarVault could increase the number of primary points for crafting e.g. to 2000.

1100 points is what a crafter already has in MO1. It hopefully will be possible to add engineering or cooking to armor or weapon crafting, but it isn't enough to extract and craft or make both weapons and armor. Doubt anyone is going to craft at 70 skill level and sacrifice dura, either.
What it boils down to is having an account with only two characters worth of skill points instead of four with the added inconveniences of having to share bank space and of only being able to be in 1 place at a time.
It would help if they gave us 3300 crafting points to equal the 3 other character slots of an MO1 account.

 

[Vakirauta]

If they give us 3k pts, then the whole idea of having only one character would be nonsense

 

[Rorry]

If they give us 3k pts, then the whole idea of having only one character would be nonsense

We would still be stuck in only 1 place at a time and have only 1 bank space. Their idea of a player economy has never worked well and won't suddenly begin to with a new game.

 

[KermyWormy]

You're asking for too much do it all mate, that's not what they're aiming for

 

[ThaBadMan]

No one will aim for the keep first, just open up access to the priests and then you can take the keep at your leisure.
I haven't heard any plans from SV to curb ninja siegeing, so It will be a factor again.

Some will for sure, just like MO.

Anyway simply because they will be more sought after later on doesnt mean it shouldnt be focused on before it arrives, TC that is.

Ninja sieging is something they are looking into possibly limiting they have stated, if it will or how we have no idea.

Whats good with 1 char per account is that every action you take needs a reason and your full effort, simply going somewhere not in your neighbourhood will take considerable time compared to MO which was rather time consuming with its travel times.
Hopefully along with the new flagging system you also wont shit where you eat as they say and fuckup in your home turf for short term gain.

 

[Rorry]

You're asking for too much do it all mate, that's not what they're aiming for

What they are aiming for is less important than what actually will be. What I mean is, they always have good intentions, but what actually exists rarely mirrors those intentions.

Whats good with 1 char per account is that every action you take needs a reason and your full effort, simply going somewhere not in your neighbourhood will take considerable time compared to MO which was rather time consuming with its travel times.
Hopefully along with the new flagging system you also wont shit where you eat as they say and fuckup in your home turf for short term gain.

Why is having things take MORE time a good thing? Already when we were in Quad it was hard to get everyone to go anywhere other than just to GK for a fight because of how much time it took.

I can't find much written about the new flagging system so I don't know for sure how that will affect it, but it seems it could be better if you are in the guild that controls your area , but worse if you are not.

 

[ThaBadMan]

What they are aiming for is less important than what actually will be. What I mean is, they always have good intentions, but what actually exists rarely mirrors those intentions.



Why is having things take MORE time a good thing? Already when we were in Quad it was hard to get everyone to go anywhere other than just to GK for a fight because of how much time it took.

I can't find much written about the new flagging system so I don't know for sure how that will affect it, but it seems it could be better if you are in the guild that controls your area , but worse if you are not.

Well I guess it all depends, the bigger world is gonna be terrible if we dont get any added population from MOs.

If the number of active players arrive then for sure it will be better.
Players will spread out and find their home and local regaional conflicts will start, rivalries, continuation of old grudges, etc.
Hopefully the game is built around being active in the game world your whole play time for the most part, and so you wont go far in order to find groups.

What I fear is the long term. If the game cant hold players playing, or that not enough system force you out in the wilderness for most of normal play day.

The population is always the question with these games and the key for it to work and yield benefits.

Also remember MO regarding housing and how ugly that looked, and the population was never as good as it should have been.

 

[Rhias]

1100 points is what a crafter already has in MO1. It hopefully will be possible to add engineering or cooking to armor or weapon crafting, but it isn't enough to extract and craft or make both weapons and armor. Doubt anyone is going to craft at 70 skill level and sacrifice dura, either.
What it boils down to is having an account with only two characters worth of skill points instead of four with the added inconveniences of having to share bank space and of only being able to be in 1 place at a time.
It would help if they gave us 3300 crafting points to equal the 3 other character slots of an MO1 account.

3.3k? How many skill points are needed to skill everything? Less than 3k?

 

[Rorry]

3.3k? How many skill points are needed to skill everything? Less than 3k?

No, no, everything would take much more than 3.3k. 3.3k would just equal the amount that we get from 1 account in MO1.