Add forced player looting

[SilentPony]

1. Make better UI for existing options, like /droploot command. I am tired of trying to explain to people I try to rob what I want them to do. Most just stare at me emptily for a minute and then try to run away, which gets them (and their horse) killed. People should never have to use chat commands (that are also not written anywhere, it seems) for gameplay actions.

2. Add options to force robbing. I want to be able to check the inventory of other players and their horses and take things from there against their will. Perhaps should require some kind of mercy mode extension or something. Maybe upcoming stealing will do that, but from what I read, you won't be able to take everything from your target, so it is not exactly that.

3. As a reasonable implementation of the previous point (#2), make the button "Surrender" (I think it is called that) in mercy mode that actually opens up you to being looted (including your horse inventory) instead of suiciding. By the way, when I was first put into the mercy mode, I actually was surprised that the button killed me instead.

All the options above make robbing people more intuitive and pleasant for everyone involved and will make killing horses unnecessary. Currently you can't really check what is inside the horse and take it without killing it. And I don't think the developers want to encourage killing horses, even though currently pretty much every mechanic just screams "kill the horse first".

 

[Evelyn]

We need robbery options so we don't always have to kill people and/or their horses to see if they have loot you want. You can't trust talking to them, they will just delete loot.

 

[Najwalaylah]

We need robbery options so we don't always have to kill people and/or their horses to see if they have loot you want. You can't trust talking to them, they will just delete loot.

That wouldn't be just because killing them has a penalty you're trying to avoid while getting the beneifit of plunderting their (living) bodies, would it? Assuming we can trust talking to someone about it.

 

[Lord Hair Remover]

Would be an interesting addition.

 

[Belteyn]

An excellent suggestion. Making it easier to rob people without needing to kill them would I think be an option that would greatly encourage newer players to the game, as for many the frustration is not so much losing their loot (they probably have very little) , its the massive distances involved in re-spawning.

 

[Evelyn]

That wouldn't be just because killing them has a penalty you're trying to avoid while getting the beneifit of plunderting their (living) bodies, would it? Assuming we can trust talking to someone about it.

No!
....
maybe

maybe I just want to let them go about their day instead of sending them to priest c:

No really though, sometimes you can't tell if a tagless is a newb or somebody on a sneaky alt trying to run a house deed or a stack of steel. Currently, you just have to smack the pinata and see if it has any candy.

 

[ArcaneConsular]

The problem is that your life in a video game where you can easily respawn isn't equal to your life in real life. So in a game getting robbed and losing all your items is basically the same as getting killed. So basically you want to be able to kill people without penalty...

 

[SilentPony]

The problem is that your life in a video game where you can easily respawn isn't equal to your life in real life. So in a game getting robbed and losing all your items is basically the same as getting killed. So basically you want to be able to kill people without penalty...

You don't lose your horse, though. And I probably would not take something like leather armor, poor bows, inexpensive weapons and the like, so the player can continue doing whatever they were doing in many cases, like traveling somewhere to hunt / gather / kill bandits / buy books.

 

[Najwalaylah]

The problem is that your life in a video game where you can easily respawn isn't equal to your life in real life. So in a game getting robbed and losing all your items is basically the same as getting killed. So basically you want to be able to kill people without penalty...

That might not be what the OP wants, but it is what every robber would get: the effect of having killed and taken, from simply being able to take without possible penalty to standing.

I think this would be a great idea in the best of all possible worlds, but that's not the game that's being played or balanced (with or without this option). I once (almost wordlessly, out of necessity) as Casilda offered a RUSsian player a fistfight for a bunch of wolf peaches (tomatoes, remember?) I had been picking, and he (alone out of his little party of three) boxed me into MM and when I recovered (alive, to my surprise) I handed them over. This was even before /droploot in MO1. That did save me some minutes of ghosting and recovery. It got him... Wolf Peaches, without a murder count. So, I see how it could work in MO2, and how it might broaden the range of interactions and responses available to those on the various sides of the exchange.

It's a tempting idea.

There's not a lot of Beta time left to test it for the possible flaws I see, nor for the flaws none of us see, yet.

PS @SilverPony 1) /Droploot should absolutely have a panic button in the UI, regardless.

2) /Droploot and Snoop should be the only ways to see what was or is in an inventory while the target is not yet a Lootbag. It used to be the simplest skill in Thievery to learn, for reasons, and that was one of the reasons. Bandits and event organisers alike had it.

3) Given 2) as a Premise, "Surrender" only needs to be a Pet Command.

 

[ArcaneConsular]

That might not be what the OP wants, but it is what every robber would get: the effect of having killed and taken, from simply being able to take without possible penalty to standing.

I think this would be a great idea in the best of all possible worlds, but that's not the game that's being played or balanced (with or without this option). I once (almost wordlessly, out of necessity) as Casilda offered a RUSsian player a fistfight for a bunch of wolf peaches (tomatoes, remember?) I had been picking, and he (alone out of his little party of three) boxed me into MM and when I recovered (alive, to my surprise) I handed them over. This was even before /droploot in MO1. That did save me some minutes of ghosting and recovery. It got him... Wolf Peaches, without a murder count. So, I see how it could work in MO2, and how it might broaden the range of interactions and responses available to those on the various sides of the exchange.

It's a tempting idea.

There's not a lot of Beta time left to test it for the possible flaws I see, nor for the flaws none of us see, yet.

PS @SilverPony 1) /Droploot should absolutely have a panic button in the UI, regardless.

2) /Droploot and Snoop should be the only ways to see what was or is in an inventory while the target is not yet a Lootbag. It used to be the simplest skill in Thievery to learn, for reasons, and that was one of the reasons. Bandits and event organisers alike had it.

3) Given 2) as a Premise, "Surrender" only needs to be a Pet Command.

Inventory peeking and stealing will come with thievery probably. I imagine if you just peeked into someone's inv you could make them give it to you. Robbing would have to count as a harsh rep fall or murder count. Else people would just walk up to every gatherer. Bop them on the head and take their stuff

 

[SilentPony]

Inventory peeking and stealing will come with thievery probably. I imagine if you just peeked into someone's inv you could make them give it to you. Robbing would have to count as a harsh rep fall or murder count. Else people would just walk up to every gatherer. Bop them on the head and take their stuff

Whether robbing options should come with a reputation penalty or not is a balancing issue, the developers can just attach a rep loss to them, but the option to bop someone on the head and take their stuff seems useful regardless.

And anyway, my opinion is that if a gatherer is wandering around defenseless and can not fight himself, he should be free game on any reasonable distance from a town. But that's not what I made the original post for.

 

[Najwalaylah]

I imagine if you just peeked into someone's inv you could make them give it to you.

I don't have to imagine it; it's happened to me (for, as I wrote, people in the bandit life sometimes had Snooping).

In Nave? Only sometimes.​

On the other hand, some folks had rather not give up without a fight or a stain on their assailant's reputation (if not on their conscience).

Robbing would have to count as a harsh rep fall… Else people would just walk up to every gatherer. Bop them on the head and take their stuff.

Of course, they might fail that initial 'bop' and become, ultimately, the one looted, though I don't expect that will happen often. It will happen more often in MO2 than in MO1.

 

[Lord Hair Remover]

The problem is that your life in a video game where you can easily respawn isn't equal to your life in real life. So in a game getting robbed and losing all your items is basically the same as getting killed. So basically you want to be able to kill people without penalty...

No.

The map is massive, so being robbed somewhere can mean not having your time wasted of ghosting back.

Also, being robbed could imply someone only takes your money and everything else is left alone.

Also, someone could just look into your inventory then take nothing at all.

Also, some people kill to kill. Some people just want items. This isn't in my eyes ground for reputation loss.

 

[Najwalaylah]

Some people just want items. This isn't in my eyes ground for reputation loss.

Nevertheless, it is.

 

[Vulpin]

I personally don't trust people that tell me to drop my loot bag. In a ideal world everyone will look at it an take what they want, but reality is some people will take everything an now they suffer no penalty for taking everything you have.

I played EVE online there was a similar scenario in that game were people would demand that you to drop your ships cargo an transfer them in game currency an they'd promise to let you go an not blow up your ship. 8 times out of 10 they would still blow you up if you compiled.

 

[Belteyn]

To anyone arguing against this idea... for me it comes dow to this: A Sandbox should provide the tools to allow the players to do whatever they want. With the options suggested someone could still just kill and loot as usual. Options are good. With options the PLAYERS decide what to do.

 

[Kinto]

To anyone arguing against this idea... for me it comes dow to this: A Sandbox should provide the tools to allow the players to do whatever they want. With the options suggested someone could still just kill and loot as usual. Options are good. With options the PLAYERS decide what to do.

I very much agree. This is one of those systems where I would love to have it available and not need it, then need it and not have it.

In regards to the mechanics behind thievery, I think every action should have a reaction; A cause and effect so to speak. So if you were to take loot from a player, there should be some kind of recourse to consider. "Is it worth the consequences to steal from this player" is a question that should reside in the back of the mind.

So, provided this game takes off and they have the extra hands to help, I definitely would like to see something like this.

 

[Icegoten]

I think this is a great suggestion. They already tried a system in MO1 where pickpocketing and snooping were your INT vs their INT or something like that. If you as the thief had 90+ INT over them they wouldn't receive a chat message, 50+ INT they would see "someone is snooping in your pockets", 20+ INT "Icegoten is snooping in your pockets!" or something like that is how I remember it.

They could do a similar skill with robbing where it's based on your STR difference and maybe the threaten skill could be tied into it. Two players with high STR shouldn't be easy to rob and maybe this means when you rob someone like that you get to take 1 item from them, 90+ STR over them you could take it all, 50+ STR you take 5 items (enough for an armor set), 20+ STR you take 2.

This could allow you more chances to define your character with gameplay mechanics. You'll seek out robbing the weak and frail mages and could stop them from retaliating with magic. There's always the chance players can act this out on their own but I like the idea of another player forcefully taking control of the next few minutes. Otherwise the game stays as it is now where people try to explain to others what they have to do in the game to actually get robbed. It'd be much easier to just rob someone by force than try to get them to type a certain command. Oh and what about players that speak different languages?

 

[Tzone]

This is different them thieving as you are doing it in a sneaking why. There should not need to be a skill to run your pockets like a pickpocket would. Pickpocketing is about not being caught. Running someones pockets they know its going on but cant stop it because they just got jumped.

Is anyone against this?

 

[Evelyn]

What it boils down to is this: I have no way of knowing what you might be hiding inside those horsebags. Without a way to know if you have legit nothing, this means I will need to murder your horse to see if it's nothing or if you got a bunch of nice loot in there. More often than not they have nothing and you just feel kinda shitty for killing their horse and stranding them in the middle of the khurite plains.

Even when they don't have bags, you sometimes come up on someone at a Risar Camp and all you really want is to tax them for the grainsteel and pig iron they've been farming. Majority of people will not be complaint when you tell them to drop loot or will suspiciously somehow have nothing all the sudden. Some just stare at you and don't respond (language barriers perhaps). Personally if they have no guild tag, I'd rather leave them there to go about their day after I tax 'em a little

People have valid counterpoints though and I am not sure what to say about it, other than right now murder is the best choice because the time it takes droploot after letting combat timer from being hit tick down allows for deleting items and that is a shame..