Single Price (for early purchasers) Instead of Subscription

[LivingshadeNL]

I think a subscription based model is good, but i think poor players should be able to pay the sucscription with gold. Lets say 600 Gold for a month. i talked to a lot of players which told me that they cant affort the game (Players from russia)

This would mean countless hours of grinding to pay the subscription. Nobody from Europe would grind several days, just prevent to pay the subscription of 15 Dollars, but this way the very poor players, students and more people from russia would play the game. Most players who like the game rather pay subscription becuase it supports the development.

The poor people without a jobs are keeping the games alive. And if it would cost 600 Gold, more then 80 % of the playerbase would still prefer to pay 15 Dollars instead of grinding several days. Most people earn 15-20 Bucks per Hour in Europe

In Albion you can pay the subscription with silver, but it so expencive, that 80 % of the players rather pay 10 Dollars. This business model is better. Look at their playerbase. The amount of Players from Russia is enormous. If a game have 20 k more active players, because of such a business decision, the company makes more money, as if you could only pay with dollars and exclude this countries. 20 K more players means at least 15 k Players that prefer to pay with cash. The smaller the playerbase the worse it is. If everybody see a very active game, more and more people will play.

Mention me a single player with a job who would not rather pay 15 Dollars, instead of grinding several days for the subscription. Plz make the game poor player friendly, because huge countries such as russia can not affort it and the potential is huge, because it such a big country! The people over there only earn 200-300 Dollars per month.

I understand thats quite sad that people with less money cant afford the game but linking real life money with ingame currency was never good, inflation by bots, cheaters, etc just because u can make irl money in the game so the knife has 2 sides here.

 

[Aerylac]

I seriously cannot see how people expect cosmetics to be implemented in a game like this. MO is defined by people making everything in the game.

1) Cosmetics as transmogs
If someone is coming at me in a bridal dess skin, I cannot guess what type of armor / playstyle the player is using. Concealing information = advantage. If you then don't have cosmetics, you are at a loss because you are giving away information.

2) Cosmetics as consumables
Suppose you buy a "tiger stripe dye" item from a cash shop that you can then apply to your gear, making it look more unique. Congratulations, you have now spent real money on an in game item in a full loot PvP game that you will be robbed of or murdered for.

3) Cosmetics as character only skins
Suppose the said "tiger stripe dye" item is applied to the characher and only activates when said character is wearing the appropriate gear for it. This severely devalues the skills and efforts of crafters in the game because a more unique look can be purchased from the shop. Why not just have said skins then as craftalbe in game items?

4) Purchasable unique cash shop items
I hope no one is this stupid... This has the potential to make crafting useless. And crafting for some people (like me) IS the game.

No thanks. I would much rather pay a subscription and have access to all items that would otherwise be gated behind a cashshop. Crafting is the reason I play MMOs. I always abandoned other games once I reached the level cap and crafting became usless in those games so I had to raid. I only found out about this game a month ago and the thing that drew me to play it is the subscription only mode. I am a new player. I like this. A subscription is also a contract on their end. That they (SV) have to be invested in developing and maintaining the game or they will lose loyalty and revenue.

And just because a certain model worked for some other games doesn't mean it will work here. Life doesn't go like that. MO is VERY different from other games and it appeals to less people. In my opinion it doesn't have enough public interest to keep a steady long term income from single purchase sales. It has enough interest now that it is a new game. But after 3+ years, when new games come out? Can you guarantee it?

Funny how you assume this thread is pro-cosmetics

Every reply I've had to people who've proposed that are only contemplative, and not condoning. It's a horrible model to have paid custom cosmetics in this type of game

 

[Aerylac]

I understand thats quite sad that people with less money cant afford the game but linking real life money with ingame currency was never good, inflation by bots, cheaters, etc just because u can make irl money in the game so the knife has 2 sides here.

This is the alternative I offered, besides waiving the sub fee for early testers. You're on point with that

 

[Aerylac]

eeewww i smell poor ppl

Do you know why poor people keep hardcore games alive? Because they tend to have the most hours to spare, and play the game.
Give the poor ones an in-game grind to pay for their sub and they will do it.

The whole reason I got into hardcore RPGs and other games was because I used to be poor.

This game needs to grow, and the whole reason it's reliant on a sub fee is because that's mostly stunted by gatekeeping.
Besides me wanting to see the game grow, with more people such as poor students from Russia and stuff (as mentioned by a previous comment), there are also personal ones.

People who are able to pay 15$ for every month they play the game have jobs. I have a job.
However, the difference is, since I work weird hours I am not always able to pour in to make that month of sub fee worth the time.
I'm ending up having to squeeze time in or else that 15$ for that whole month will only be used for say, 4 days of gameplay.

Honestly would be okay with the sub if I had more regular hours, since most of the workforce in my pay scale (upper middle class) have that.
I'm hoping the pandemic would make that change for me, but that's still yet to be seen.

Also, assuming that just because people can afford X means they can afford Y is a gross overestimation. Take into account the vast diversity of decisions being made by each individual.

For instance, at the time I got my PC as a gift, I was not able to afford one; with this job, I would now have been able to, so my funds went elsewhere, such as investments, renting out spaces, bills etc. Mind you, people in the same "middle class" as me pour more in to investments and such to grow what they already earn which--while their net worths are higher--sets them back for what they can spend on for some time, until they get said returns on investments. Saying that just because someone is "rich" they should be able to afford something is an assumption that pulls away from the otherwise smart decisions those people make with their money, and the costs they had to cover.

When someone buys something in Year X, doesn't always mean they'll be able to afford it again in Year Y.

 

[Aerylac]

I don’t like unlimited free trials myself. Everyone will use them to scout, blue block, give murder counts to lower rep, log off gear/goods/gold(movable banks), boulder holding, log off inside palisades, spam city chat, and all sorts of cheap/greefy machanics.

Free trials should be limited in time and skills.

however I do think the sub fee should be reduced to under 10$. Game just isn’t worth a premium sub.

10$ is more manageable; I disagree with having an unlimited Haven/free trial

 

[Aerylac]

Played MO1 for a few years so feel I have some insight into this. I understand the argument the hardcore people here are making -- the cost to helping noobs, or the casuals give bad reviews, etc -- these are all reflective of the fact that the game is by construction not a forgiving experience for new players. I do however still believe that the game itself would be way more profitable for Starvault if it was f2p with cosmetic shop. Almost every game benefits from this kind of business model because the number of casuals that arrive and spend money is typically more than what you get with small community of subbers. (I don't buy the argument "oh they can't afford to make skins" -- if the monetary incentive is there they will hire artists) This is why there are hardly any MMOs that do sub model anymore, yet it used to be the norm over a decade ago. I also believe there has to be some way to improve the new player experience and still retain players without forcing them into a subscription fee. The problem with subs is it psychologically forces you to play a game you may not necessarily feel like playing at the game, to get "your money's worth." There's no reason why the game can't be adjusted to benefit both casuals and hardcore players. This may change the game to a dramatic degree -- but without trying, how do we know it's not possible and desireable to both parties? However, that said, I think Henrik is intentionally trying to create a game that matches his own vision which is similar to say Ultima Online. For that reason he is perfectly happy with NOT making tons of money if it means keeping his game "pure" to that vision. Maybe i'm wrong, but that's what I've seen over the years. I do not think StarVault will ever try to accommodate new players to the degree that would be necessary to make the game a success for both casual and hardcore players.

By "hardcore people" I'm not sure if you mean long-time MO players or hardcore RPG/games community as a whole, but rest assured I definitely come more from the latter.

It is definitely more profitable to have a paid cosmetic model, however if SV chooses to go that route, it should not be F2P.
I still have my reluctances regarding just the cosmetic cash shop alone, as I've expressed previously, but F2P just brings a whole bag of worms along with it.

The problem with subs is it psychologically forces you to play a game you may not necessarily feel like playing at the game, to get "your money's worth."

This is one of the main personal reasons I'm vouching for a) affordable sub fee; b) waived sub fee for testers; or c) buy-to-play, even as a limited time offer
since while I do have work that compensates me handsomely, the hours are still odd, and I'm having to find time to squeeze to try to "milk" that sub fee as much I could.


While I'm finding a few seemingly self-conflicting points around this thread (ie. the studio needs money to keep running but argues against what is presented as the more profitable model, etc.), I still have a fair amount of confidence in the studio, as they've seemed to learn a lot from the previous game (only had just over ~100 hours so not even that much as I was occupied with Eve and other titles).

 

[Kokolo]

Funny how you assume this thread is pro-cosmetics

Every reply I've had to people who've proposed that are only contemplative, and not condoning. It's a horrible model to have paid custom cosmetics in this type of game

My response was more towards the several people I have seen in this thread and others proposing cosmetics. I know the point of this one is the single price model for which I also don't see much of a case as I have little faith in long term sustainability of that model for a game that is inevitably going to attract less players than say New World or Ashes of Creation because of its hardcore nature. Right now it's quite popular. Right now there is money to be made in single prices. But in 2+ years? Doubt it.

A samller subscription I can stand for. In game tokens for subscription bring in the whole issue about in game gold becoming cryptocurrency for tokens which have real money value. That then brings bots and chat spammers selling said tokens into the game. I am on the fence about the tokens for that reason.

We'll see how things play out post launch.

 

[StreamerLord]

Hopefully you can gift a sub through steam. Steam already supports that sort of thing.

 

[finegamingconnoisseur]

The sub pretty much has to happen to pay for the developers to continue development.

The one thing that many players have been pushing for though is some kind of sub token that can be purchased for cash and be a sellable in game item.

This would allow players to purchase the token with real money and sell it to other players in game for in game money.

SV still gets paid for every sub and players have an option to get subs from in game currency.

Though SV has yet to warm up to the idea.

EVE Online is perhaps well-known for its full integration of sub tokens being tradeable in-game in the form of PLEX (Pilot License Extension).

It has allowed CCP Games to make a ton of money on top of the usual monthly sub that many players already pay. The PLEX get traded like crazy with prices fluctuating daily as players buy and sell them on a mass scale.

Sometimes I look at the regional market spreadsheet for the PLEX and think to myself, CCP Games has a fat cash cow that will never run dry.

 

[Aerylac]

My response was more towards the several people I have seen in this thread and others proposing cosmetics. I know the point of this one is the single price model for which I also don't see much of a case as I have little faith in long term sustainability of that model for a game that is inevitably going to attract less players than say New World or Ashes of Creation because of its hardcore nature. Right now it's quite popular. Right now there is money to be made in single prices. But in 2+ years? Doubt it.

A samller subscription I can stand for. In game tokens for subscription bring in the whole issue about in game gold becoming cryptocurrency for tokens which have real money value. That then brings bots and chat spammers selling said tokens into the game. I am on the fence about the tokens for that reason.

We'll see how things play out post launch.

Interesting take, I never really saw the people who proposed the cosmetic model so much as spitballing. Fair point

 

[Aerylac]

EVE Online is perhaps well-known for its full integration of sub tokens being tradeable in-game in the form of PLEX (Pilot License Extension).

It has allowed CCP Games to make a ton of money on top of the usual monthly sub that many players already pay. The PLEX get traded like crazy with prices fluctuating daily as players buy and sell them on a mass scale.

Sometimes I look at the regional market spreadsheet for the PLEX and think to myself, CCP Games has a fat cash cow that will never run dry.

Hey I dig your YouTube channel! As well as Speznat's!

 

[finegamingconnoisseur]

Hey I dig your YouTube channel! As well as Speznat's!

Thank you for your kind words for both channels! ❤

 

[Speznat]

Hey I dig your YouTube channel! As well as Speznat's!

Thank you man xD party hard