On the matter of strength.

Tashka

Well-known member
Dec 4, 2021
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Strength affects many things, from your stamina pool to your armor weight, but there's one thing i personally find the most annoying. Having low strength, you are punished in three different way which complement each other: you can't use heavier weapons, which are usually just better and almost universally preferred in the same weapon group; you suffer the damage bonus penalty; and the damage you get through parries increases. It's not just "you deal less damage" or "you can't use poleaxes". It doesn't make a lot of sense to have mellee performance punished in so many ways for having low strength, if we already have strength requirement parameter on every weapon.

Don't get me wrong - i don't think that a dagger mage should be on equal footing with a thursar full steel fighter if both have equal skill. But the difference now is just too great. But it is a mellee game. Even if you are a mage, you often find yourself in a mellee range situation, and unless you have enough friends to always protect you or the opponent is a complete newbie, you don't really stand a chance with your silly mercy dagger. Because not only the dagger itself is extremely weak (i'm talking damage wise, not range etc) even when it weakspots, but your damage bonus is probably in -20% figures. -20% doesn't sound much but in reality it means that you'll be weakspotting reptile carapace mercenary for ~15 maybe, even if you are fully specced into daggers and aggressive stance. And you won't always be weakspotting. On top of that, you take significant damage through parries even with maxed blocking, and if the opponent has a heavy weapon like an axe or a maul, then even through shield.

Necromancy won't be a magic pill. It's range is low and eventually (rather quickly actually) you will oom and either have to face your opponent in mellee, or flee. And unless you are a veela or at least a sheevra, you'll probably won't do be able to do much anyway, because at least 30% of mellee players a veelas, so your runnin&castin will be made obsolete in a few seconds unless, again, you are in a sizable group. It is a mellee game, this is just how it is. I don't think much can be done about it. If your mellee performance is terrible, you'll never feel good solo or in really small group (2-3 people).


Not only this hurts mages, but build variability in general. Like, a steel katana only requires 41 strength. How many people with katanas do you see? Not so many i believe. There are some. There are full mellee fighters who use daggers too, but those are exceptions. Because what's the point? You can swing heavy great sword, you better swing that. You can't just say "katanas are good enough, i'll lower my strength to invest in psyche to troll mages", because not only 41 strength limits you to a katana - a rather weak and the shortest of all swords - but it also makes you take chip damage, it also lowers your damage bonus to sub-zero levels, it cripples your stamina, it reduces your ability to wear heavy armor. And on top of that, you can't use bows because the lowest strreq bow that is worth using at all is crep/crep shortbow, and it's below your ability even if you have alvarin gifts.

I suggest to either remove *negative* mellee bonus (so it never falls below 0) or have strength not affect your parrying ability. Not both, because it would be a net nerf to mages since people will have a lot more points to invest in psyche. Low strength should still be a rarity for mellee fighters, but it shouldn't cripple you in so many ways.
 

Doom and Gloom

Active member
Mar 12, 2022
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Wait, parrying is weaker if you have lower strength? I thought it was always full damage block. I do only play mage though so I wouldn't know.
 

RaptorBlackz

Member
Sep 4, 2020
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Australia
I like the low str weaknesses, Actually gives purpose to the warriors against turtling mages, Would suck for them to parry everything you throw at them and they have 0parry dmg while they have like 10str and you have like 112+.

Would need to wait for Staff-Magic to come out to see how that changes the mage-style of gameplay, I would expect alot of mages running around with staffs and clubbing people with high blunt damage if specc'd enough.
 

Tashka

Well-known member
Dec 4, 2021
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Would suck for them to parry everything you throw at them and they have 0parry dmg while they have like 10str and you have like 112+.
They can't do much to you anyway. I too have hopes for staff magic but it's not good for the game when current problems are ignored because some future expansion (which may still be months or even years away) may or may not fix them.
 

Hodo

Well-known member
Mar 7, 2022
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Wait, parrying is weaker if you have lower strength? I thought it was always full damage block. I do only play mage though so I wouldn't know.

Because you dont have blocking maxed. If you have 100 blocking and 100 defensive stance you can block most if not all of the incoming damage when you block correctly.
 

Tashka

Well-known member
Dec 4, 2021
666
416
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Because you dont have blocking maxed. If you have 100 blocking and 100 defensive stance you can block most if not all of the incoming damage when you block correctly.
This isn't true. Even with max blocking and defensive stance you get hit through parries even while wearing reptile merc if you're below 50 strength.