Mounted instant/simple combat balance suggestion (but you will resist it)
- Thread starter SeaShadow
- Start date
In their current state this probably isn't a bad suggestion. And the only reason I would resist this is because they SHOULD give more value than they currently do.
I really don't want to play another MMO where mounted combat is worthless. I have every other MMO on the market to provide that already, and big factor in my decision to buy this game is the promise they wouldn't be here.
I really don't want to play another MMO where mounted combat is worthless. I have every other MMO on the market to provide that already, and big factor in my decision to buy this game is the promise they wouldn't be here.
plz no. in their current state this is bad. right now people have to make sacrifices for mounted, i think a lot of people are running something other than 0 or 100 which is great.
Lol. Comments like this make it painfully obvious how pay to win this poorly conceived single character system is. Most my PvP focused characters have no mounted skills at all and instead run builds that are significantly more dangerous on foot due to all the points I save not doing that.
However the 1 mounted focused build I'm working on for mounted PvP roams has controlled riding, 100 mounted combat, 100 mounted magery, and 100 ritualism to make tankier/faster mounts and wreck your crap in melee, wreck your crap at a range, and heal his own horse.
If I face one of these luke warm "My build can do everything" guys on foot, I am at a massive advantage as I'm likely going to be facing them on a foot character. If I face them mounted, I am REALLY going to eat them to breakfast because I'm DEFINATELY going to face them on my mounted character who has 3 different aspects of mounted combat maxed and working together while they're thinking their half-leveled MC or MA is going to save them.
This is why when I said "all the best builds do two roles" in another thread I meant two roles. MAYBE 3 roles on the right build. Like I guess my MM/MC build is a semi-decent foot hybrid if he's dismounted. All the best builds have multi-functionality so they aren't countered easily. But all the best builds also have identified the essential stats for both of their focus roles and run every single one of them at 100.
I literally cringe when I see things like someone's primary melee weapon, archery skill, mental offense, or any single mounted damage stat at anything between no points, and 100.
It's crazy SV doesn't understand anyone with more than one character gets to work on an entirely different meta than those who don't have that. It's a straight pay to win system. Or maybe they really just do want multiple subs to be the meta.
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i don't know shit. i just know that even with mounted range being 100 theres a lot more moving pieces to being good on mount. to be fair i just know i hardly survive a lot of mounted encounters and if mounted was secondary i would probably dead WAY more than i am.
The ability to run MC + MM is insanely powerful if employed correctly.
MC is hands down the weakest role in the game for fighting anyone but total scrubs. It can be parried by anyone on foot beyond how easy it is to use terrain to avoid even having to do that, and anyone on a mount of the same or greater speed can simply turn away and ride the other direction, negating you entirely until they stam. And if you both end up out of stam a MA or MM can easily kill you at that point as they are not dependent upon speed for damage. Plus if they have allies they may get peels before you reach them even on a slower mount.
However it is insanely powerful if you actually are landing hits. It can absolutely wreck an enemy horse faster than anything else in the game.
MM rounds out MCs weaknesses by providing ranged attacks you can use to pressure a fleeing opponent. It also provides mount healing and is very effective against heavily armored horses. And MM are capable of winning fights against FF which MC simply are not if the FF is at all good.
Combining the two turns you into an MM who can switch to MC and land some devastating blows if the opportunity arises. It's quite strong. Substantially stronger than pure MC, and also a fair bit stronger than pure MM if utilized effectively.
Adding necro horses into the mix kicks it up a notch. A big notch. Ritualism pets may be much weaker than their tamed and dominated counterparts but the horses are straight up better if you run it at 100.
The three employed in conjunction? Someone with 70 MA isn't going to know what hit them if you train to use it that build at all.
300 points on mounted skills though is insane based on how mounted is currently balanced. Assuming that is your only account. Technically 500 if you count necro and ritualism but those are hard to count when necro is a very worthwhile school and ritulaism does provide combat pets. Still the combat pets aren't very good compared to the mounts. They aren't exactly nothing at all though.
MC is hands down the weakest role in the game for fighting anyone but total scrubs. It can be parried by anyone on foot beyond how easy it is to use terrain to avoid even having to do that, and anyone on a mount of the same or greater speed can simply turn away and ride the other direction, negating you entirely until they stam. And if you both end up out of stam a MA or MM can easily kill you at that point as they are not dependent upon speed for damage. Plus if they have allies they may get peels before you reach them even on a slower mount.
However it is insanely powerful if you actually are landing hits. It can absolutely wreck an enemy horse faster than anything else in the game.
MM rounds out MCs weaknesses by providing ranged attacks you can use to pressure a fleeing opponent. It also provides mount healing and is very effective against heavily armored horses. And MM are capable of winning fights against FF which MC simply are not if the FF is at all good.
Combining the two turns you into an MM who can switch to MC and land some devastating blows if the opportunity arises. It's quite strong. Substantially stronger than pure MC, and also a fair bit stronger than pure MM if utilized effectively.
Adding necro horses into the mix kicks it up a notch. A big notch. Ritualism pets may be much weaker than their tamed and dominated counterparts but the horses are straight up better if you run it at 100.
The three employed in conjunction? Someone with 70 MA isn't going to know what hit them if you train to use it that build at all.
300 points on mounted skills though is insane based on how mounted is currently balanced. Assuming that is your only account. Technically 500 if you count necro and ritualism but those are hard to count when necro is a very worthwhile school and ritulaism does provide combat pets. Still the combat pets aren't very good compared to the mounts. They aren't exactly nothing at all though.
Its a semi-viable foot hybrid that's very powerful in mounted fights. You could do worse for a single character. That being said it's got controlled riding, mounted magery, and mounted combat. Foot hybrids are already very strapped for points.
For contrast, you could drop necromancy and ritualism and take CC, Adv CC, Beast Mastery, and then have points left over to take any other school of magic or domination.
You could also use said points for additional armor training, anatomy, defensive stance, or any other number of things a build stretched that thin has issues affording.
Either way you're going to have a substantial edge over this build in a pure foot fight.
The reason I think to make more secondary, is because a lot of the game is twitch based or player knowledge based. Everything is hyper-specialized when it comes to how skill points are allocated, however. Why bother with that in a game that requires precise timing and aiming? It locks off the content of switching between a sword for instance, and picking up a star mace at random and still being able to use it effectively. Not just to swap between mounted and foot, but why not weapons too.
So many new players get blasted to bits when they try to travel or transport things because they didn't happen to take mounted skills. They have a sword or a bow but cant do damage from horse back so are easy targets. So, being able to deal mostly equal damage wouldn't make them an expert on a mount as a player. When I say make them Secondaries, it wouldn't have to be fully but the skill system goes 0-100 for everything. It could go 0-25, for the final meta bonuses without leaving people cold for not having the right build in Rock-Paper-Scissors situations.
So many new players get blasted to bits when they try to travel or transport things because they didn't happen to take mounted skills. They have a sword or a bow but cant do damage from horse back so are easy targets. So, being able to deal mostly equal damage wouldn't make them an expert on a mount as a player. When I say make them Secondaries, it wouldn't have to be fully but the skill system goes 0-100 for everything. It could go 0-25, for the final meta bonuses without leaving people cold for not having the right build in Rock-Paper-Scissors situations.
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I feel like games that allow you to change your build readily and easily are a lot more fun to play, and it would be super awesome to see the kind of freedom that would allow you to swap to more mounted skills if you are going out riding with your guild and then swap them back out of your build if you will be hanging around town all day.
That being said, as amazing as a Guild Wars 1 / EVE style system where you can easily change up your build would be, they've committed pretty heavily to what they have going on now and would be difficult to course correct at this point.
We've seen the issue with "everyone can do everything all at once" with Darkfall. Eventually it leads to a single ultimate hybrid build becoming the only viable meta. So they have to keep some limitations in for build diversity. If they're keeping some limitations in, I'd rather see cavalry be a distinct role worth playing. Not something everyone gets for free.
That being said, as amazing as a Guild Wars 1 / EVE style system where you can easily change up your build would be, they've committed pretty heavily to what they have going on now and would be difficult to course correct at this point.
We've seen the issue with "everyone can do everything all at once" with Darkfall. Eventually it leads to a single ultimate hybrid build becoming the only viable meta. So they have to keep some limitations in for build diversity. If they're keeping some limitations in, I'd rather see cavalry be a distinct role worth playing. Not something everyone gets for free.
They need to make mounted not required to play the game. Currently playing anything but mounted is a waste of time. Takes 6 minutes to walk from MK GY to the closest bank. 10 mins from the exit of the sewers. Double that for a full trip there and back. Of raw time sink. Complete BS.
Then if you didnt have to play mounted to do anything, they can make it actually a choice for people who actually enjoy it to spec into their builds.
Then if you didnt have to play mounted to do anything, they can make it actually a choice for people who actually enjoy it to spec into their builds.
Yeah, changes like these are an absolute must to see mounted be balanced as a combat role but also not the only thing that gets played.
Mounted is the strongest utility role in the game. And an absolute joke as a combat style no matter what the idiots who think otherwise say.
Mounted is the strongest utility role in the game. And an absolute joke as a combat style no matter what the idiots who think otherwise say.
I think at least half the community pushes balance decisions based on precisely that. By by "the style of play" they don't like, I mean literally anything other than foot melee. Unfortunately SV does listen to enough of that feedback that it obviously effects things.
Mounted Archery build is much easier and safer to farm most creatures with as well. The imbalance isn't only Pvp by any means. So one character per account isn't anything to do with the number of accounts you need to be meta, it's more of a sales decision which is a lot different than one player one character.
The one character per account thing is a money grab pure and simple. Some games operate that way and aren't money grabs (Wurm, Runescape, Darkfall etc.) but in MO2, it's needed to experience the full game and still operate competitively.
There are a lot of really bad decisions (sprinting/combat maneuvering/blocking as primaries, taming as an action rather than a profession, no early game spells that let you move and cast, zoologies being so valuable to combat builds, the entire existence of crafting clades etc.) that make the game substantially easier if you are running more than one character at a time.
The fact that instead of fixing and addressing these, they keep adding more and more makes it very obvious that pushing people into purchasing more accounts is the intent and not a side effect.
There are a lot of really bad decisions (sprinting/combat maneuvering/blocking as primaries, taming as an action rather than a profession, no early game spells that let you move and cast, zoologies being so valuable to combat builds, the entire existence of crafting clades etc.) that make the game substantially easier if you are running more than one character at a time.
The fact that instead of fixing and addressing these, they keep adding more and more makes it very obvious that pushing people into purchasing more accounts is the intent and not a side effect.
Hit the nail on the head with this. Since the population is so low they need to milk the existing customers as hard as they can. No race respec being available just proves that in an additional way.
Substantial damage buffs to animals including horses and pets. It's REALLY valuable in PVE and also a major deal in PVP. I run 100 Equidae even on my foot only builds because the outgoing damage to enemy horses is such a big deal. Obscure things like terror bird zoology will come into play less often but make a big difference when it does. Every combat build needs 100 mammalia for horses, molvas, wolves, bears, campadons, taur dogs, cougars etc. I run all the others too on every build except dedicated non-combat characters like my tamer. Reptiles, birds, spiders. If an enemy may use it in combat I try to max the lore on all my combat builds.
Oh wow, the skills actually do what they say now lmao. Only took like 10 years. Have you tested how much 0 to 100 gain actually is?