Let's put the MOUNT back into Mounted Magery

[Doom and Gloom]

A big no. Many of us top tier mounted mages WANTED it to be like this. This would completely wreck the game.

Then you have no idea about what is balanced and what is unplayable. If you really are some "pro" and think this is fine for MM and stuff like MA is fine as it is, no wonder MO1 died. This is a ridiculous mechanic, which maybe does something if you are in a large group who protects you from everything, even then unbelievably clunky to play and weak af.

 

[Dramonis]

Mage / Healer in a 1 v 1 situation should be feared not looked as a easy kill.

There is no mage in the current game, what we have is a glittering punch bag.

 

[zozo]

I know this is a longshot, but I would love for @Henrik Nyström to give some perspective or counter arguments to what has been discussed.

What we're asking for is only to have a more equal playing field.

 

[Archiel]

I know this is a longshot, but I would love for @Henrik Nyström to give some perspective or counter arguments to what has been discussed.

What we're asking for is only to have a more equal playing field.

Equal playing field? Mounted fat mage is superior to almost all classes except an MA in terms of the ratio between player skill required and outcome.

MO1 had a bug that players abused that allowed them to turn while casting on their fatmages and it made them practically invincible while having very high damage output

 

[tumor]

Then you have no idea about what is balanced and what is unplayable. If you really are some "pro" and think this is fine for MM and stuff like MA is fine as it is, no wonder MO1 died. This is a ridiculous mechanic, which maybe does something if you are in a large group who protects you from everything, even then unbelievably clunky to play and weak af.

Put more words in my mouth moron. Never said its okay how it is or MA is okay. The class is extremely boring and counter intuitive but can be effective. These changes would just make it the god class.

 

[FreeHorses]

No

 

[Myta]

Looking at them isolated, I think the restrictions for MM are good. Without these restrictions, MM would be extremly strong and no mage could skip it ever. So in itself thats a good design

The problem arises when comparing it to MA, thats when MM starts to look like pure shit. Because MA does not have these restrictions while doing more damage at a longer range. MA can easily cheese every pve encounter, MA is so good that its mandatory for every character that can use a bow ( so everyone except mages) its so good that no mage can hope to ever win against MA, no matter if he is mounted or not.

This difference in power just does not make sense. So there are two options:
1. Decide that mounts are mandatory and should rule everything, then MM has to be brought up to to the level of MA. In that canse the MM restrictions must go away
2. Decide mounted styles should not dominate everything, then MM is fine and instead MA has to be brought down to the level of MM, which probably means reducing the damage and also not allow them to turn.

 

[zozo]

Looking at them isolated, I think the restrictions for MM are good. Without these restrictions, MM would be extremly strong and no mage could skip it ever. So in itself thats a good design

The problem arises when comparing it to MA, thats when MM starts to look like pure shit. Because MA does not have these restrictions while doing more damage at a longer range. MA can easily cheese every pve encounter, MA is so good that its mandatory for every character that can use a bow ( so everyone except mages) its so good that no mage can hope to ever win against MA, no matter if he is mounted or not.

This difference in power just does not make sense. So there are two options:
1. Decide that mounts are mandatory and should rule everything, then MM has to be brought up to to the level of MA. In that canse the MM restrictions must go away
2. Decide mounted styles should not dominate everything, then MM is fine and instead MA has to be brought down to the level of MM, which probably means reducing the damage and also not allow them to turn.

You're right that a lot of frustration is because mounts die so quickly from MAs/longbow that there is no counter-play except not to be on a mount.

However, even if MAs were brought down to a similar level as MM by making it so they can't turn while shooting; MMs still get the shaft because you can't turn while casting, doubled casting time, and 70% chance to interrupt a cast. MM shouldn't have this triple penalty. The increased interrupt chance should be the base of 30% (or removed entirely honestly) and either casting is increased or you can't turn while casting, not both! (Subject to mounts not being 2 shot anymore)

 

[Myta]

However, even if MAs were brought down to a similar level as MM by making it so they can't turn while shooting; MMs still get the shaft because you can't turn while casting, doubled casting time, and 70% chance to interrupt a cast

Sure, thats why I said that bringing MA down to MM probably means not allowing them to turn AND reducing the damage. The damage would have to be reduced by at least 50% just to account for the doubled cast time, and then probably another 20% to account for the increased interrupts.

 

[Dramonis]

i still keep my idea MA longer time to btw shoots, Not able to turn while aiming, smaller range and Mounted Archery +100 cost just to stay even with MM

And heavy armor nomally makes aim wobble as if you were running and shooting and heavy armor + mount = 2x Wobble

 

[Jandles]

I agree that mounted magery is ass in its current form, I hate not being able to turn my horse while casting, it just feels so offputting to me, the cast time is fine, i wouldnt even care if they made casts 3x longer but allowed us to turn while casting, just fix it and make it feel more fun to play, having to straight line into trees, rocks, or off a cliff while casting is not fun or enjoyable.

 

[FreeHorses]

Fatmage isn't bad but there's bad fatmages.

 

[billbonty]

What I’ve observed whenever this gets brought up to Henrik is that he immediately talks about how magic can go through armor and that there will be more magic schools on the way (13 schools total).

The problem isn’t magic itself or the damage it does with a single shot. We all love that part… but balancing magic and it’s properties around a TON of magic not in the game is bad design. Ecumenical and spiritist mages should be able to compete with base level mounted archers and this brand new skill Mounted Magery should absolutely be more desirable than it is.

I’ve heard every argument for and against buffs and nerfs to magic. The top level mages including myself can hold our own against bad mounted archers at times but it doesn’t take much to overpower a mage and we have to be at the top of our game to survive and we’re still just rolling dice to see if that arrow will interrupt us or not.

MM vs MA you have to dismount as a mage to have a chance if you are solo. There’s 0 way to out dps even a beginner MA as a MM while mounted unless you are wearing 10kg armor as a mage. (Only humans could pull that off) Any and every archer can shoot further than you as well and provide no audio indications that you or your mount took damage except for a subtle thud. Most players that are just traveling will just have their horse die immediately and be very confused.

Mounted archers should have to use stam to shoot bows. Corrupt should cause them to release the arrow being pulled unless they ALSO have concentration or something similar. Many archery skills aren’t “needed” by Mounted archers as well which doesn’t make sense either like aiming technique. Mage armor also doesn’t do anything to protect yourself against archers and shields aren’t arrow magnets, most good archers are aiming for your other body parts anyways.

Whole thing is just a mess and there’s a dozen ways to fix the situation. Just please do it one step at a time and not all at once.

 

[zozo]

Henrik has said this, "Every school have diff rules though on foot on mount on movement" during a twitch stream when asked about letting MM cast and turn while mounted.

It makes sense that the current implemented schools of magic cannot move and cast at the same time while on foot, but it doesn't make sense that you can't turn the mount while casting. You can still cast while the mount moves forward...logic would dictate that you can also cast when the mount turns. (in before troll suggestions to remove casting while moving on mount)

How do MAs turn the horse while firing a bow? Did they learn that ability through their Mounted Archery action skills but Mounted Mages missed that lesson? Do they have magical feet that control the horse?

Comparisons and small jokes aside, having to constantly stop and re-start casting a spell to simply steer the mount 10 degrees to the left or right is not good gameplay. It is a poor mechanic that should be changed. It is not fun. It does not make sense when you put 200 primary points into a skill.

 

[Tzone]

What I’ve observed whenever this gets brought up to Henrik is that he immediately talks about how magic can go through armor and that there will be more magic schools on the way (13 schools total).

The problem isn’t magic itself or the damage it does with a single shot. We all love that part… but balancing magic and it’s properties around a TON of magic not in the game is bad design. Ecumenical and spiritist mages should be able to compete with base level mounted archers and this brand new skill Mounted Magery should absolutely be more desirable than it is.

I’ve heard every argument for and against buffs and nerfs to magic. The top level mages including myself can hold our own against bad mounted archers at times but it doesn’t take much to overpower a mage and we have to be at the top of our game to survive and we’re still just rolling dice to see if that arrow will interrupt us or not.

MM vs MA you have to dismount as a mage to have a chance if you are solo. There’s 0 way to out dps even a beginner MA as a MM while mounted unless you are wearing 10kg armor as a mage. (Only humans could pull that off) Any and every archer can shoot further than you as well and provide no audio indications that you or your mount took damage except for a subtle thud. Most players that are just traveling will just have their horse die immediately and be very confused.

Mounted archers should have to use stam to shoot bows. Corrupt should cause them to release the arrow being pulled unless they ALSO have concentration or something similar. Many archery skills aren’t “needed” by Mounted archers as well which doesn’t make sense either like aiming technique. Mage armor also doesn’t do anything to protect yourself against archers and shields aren’t arrow magnets, most good archers are aiming for your other body parts anyways.

Whole thing is just a mess and there’s a dozen ways to fix the situation. Just please do it one step at a time and not all at once.

You are not a top mage

 

[FreeHorses]

Henrik has said this, "Every school have diff rules though on foot on mount on movement" during a twitch stream when asked about letting MM cast and turn while mounted.

It makes sense that the current implemented schools of magic cannot move and cast at the same time while on foot, but it doesn't make sense that you can't turn the mount while casting. You can still cast while the mount moves forward...logic would dictate that you can also cast when the mount turns. (in before troll suggestions to remove casting while moving on mount)

How do MAs turn the horse while firing a bow? Did they learn that ability through their Mounted Archery action skills but Mounted Mages missed that lesson? Do they have magical feet that control the horse?

Comparisons and small jokes aside, having to constantly stop and re-start casting a spell to simply steer the mount 10 degrees to the left or right is not good gameplay. It is a poor mechanic that should be changed. It is not fun. It does not make sense when you put 200 primary points into a skill.

Im very happy you are not on the balancing team.
Moving while casting ecu would destroy this game.

 

[zozo]

Im very happy you are not on the balancing team.
Moving while casting ecu would destroy this game.

You can move forward while casting on the mount and the game isn't destroyed.

 

[FreeHorses]

You can move forward while casting on the mount and the game isn't destroyed.

don't conflate what im saying to you. You know what we are talking about.

 

[Jandles]

Henrik has said this, "Every school have diff rules though on foot on mount on movement" during a twitch stream when asked about letting MM cast and turn while mounted.

It makes sense that the current implemented schools of magic cannot move and cast at the same time while on foot, but it doesn't make sense that you can't turn the mount while casting. You can still cast while the mount moves forward...logic would dictate that you can also cast when the mount turns. (in before troll suggestions to remove casting while moving on mount)

How do MAs turn the horse while firing a bow? Did they learn that ability through their Mounted Archery action skills but Mounted Mages missed that lesson? Do they have magical feet that control the horse?

Comparisons and small jokes aside, having to constantly stop and re-start casting a spell to simply steer the mount 10 degrees to the left or right is not good gameplay. It is a poor mechanic that should be changed. It is not fun. It does not make sense when you put 200 primary points into a skill.

Not to mention, currently playing as a mounted mage completely makes one of your stats redundant, dexterity is supposed to make acceleration and turning on a horse better, but if you play a mage you can forget about it, as being on a horse makes you an idiot somehow.

 

[zozo]

don't conflate what im saying to you. You know what we are talking about.

Yes, we're talking about moving while casting ecumenical spells. You can already cast ecumenical spells while moving forward on a mount. Being able to turn and cast while moving forward would not be game-breaking.