Bonding

[AssassinOTL]

I've Heard of a Function in UO where you could Bond with your pet, this is an important system if you know what it does, pleas add this with all it's perks it would be greatly appreciated, and is an important system that's missing and would greatly benefit gameplay loop

 

[ArcaneConsular]

trust me there's no point getting too attached to your pets

 

[Kaemik]

@AssassinOTL

I'm assuming this is some kind of mechanic so you can have the same pet long-term? Like it allows a revive if they die?

How does it work in terms of economy balance? Right now the fact you have to run halfway back across the map, tame a young pet, and level it to full is a huge part of what seems to keep everyone from going beastmaster despite it being hands down the most powerful role in the game if you have a level 125 pet of a good type.

Is this something the bonding system accounts for?

 

[Vrenmar]

@AssassinOTL

I'm assuming this is some kind of mechanic so you can have the same pet long-term? Like it allows a revive if they die?

How does it work in terms of economy balance? Right now the fact you have to run halfway back across the map, tame a young pet, and level it to full is a huge part of what seems to keep everyone from going beastmaster despite it being hands down the most powerful role in the game if you have a level 125 pet of a good type.

Is this something the bonding system accounts for?

Bonding was a mechanic from Original UO pre trammel where if your pet died you could rez it at a stable master or with veterinary. I don't think it would fit too well into the game of mortal unless pets had stat loss or durability or something to that effect. Even then I would prefer they kept the pet disposable but balanced it a bit better by adding breeding and changing animal care to profession pool as it makes no sense currently that is in combat tree.

The main problem with pets is that it takes forever to level them to the point their useful, I had a black bear on haven been stuck in haven for a week and i got it to level 50 before it didn't log off with me and went grey and died. I did A LOT of zombie farming with him at loyalty 1000 and for DAYS in a NO PVP environment he didn't get anywhere near max level.

So everyone complaining about how OP 125 pets are in a fight dont realize its an extremely niche gimick situation because getting one that high is pretty unrealistic and a massive time investment.

Also pets are kinda location bound at the moment until breeding is implemented.

 

[Tashka]

Would make beastmasters and anything mounted OP af.

 

[Vrenmar]

Would make beastmasters and anything mounted OP af.

maybe, unless it was balanced by having a cost associated with it. This is asking for durability on pets and more work which SV probably doesnt have time for. I can make the argument you can use the same set of gear multiple deaths in a row if your group wins the fight, Would love to see gear trash or get broken on death to help with gear inflation but thats the subject for another thread.

 

[AssassinOTL]

@AssassinOTL

I'm assuming this is some kind of mechanic so you can have the same pet long-term? Like it allows a revive if they die?

How does it work in terms of economy balance? Right now the fact you have to run halfway back across the map, tame a young pet, and level it to full is a huge part of what seems to keep everyone from going beastmaster despite it being hands down the most powerful role in the game if you have a level 125 pet of a good type.

Is this something the bonding system accounts for?

it covers quite a bit and UO economics was fine with the system in

 

[Philthie]

Bonding was a mechanic from Original UO pre trammel where if your pet died you could rez it at a stable master or with veterinary. I don't think it would fit too well into the game of mortal unless pets had stat loss or durability or something to that effect. Even then I would prefer they kept the pet disposable but balanced it a bit better by adding breeding and changing animal care to profession pool as it makes no sense currently that is in combat tree.

The main problem with pets is that it takes forever to level them to the point their useful, I had a black bear on haven been stuck in haven for a week and i got it to level 50 before it didn't log off with me and went grey and died. I did A LOT of zombie farming with him at loyalty 1000 and for DAYS in a NO PVP environment he didn't get anywhere near max level.

So everyone complaining about how OP 125 pets are in a fight dont realize its an extremely niche gimick situation because getting one that high is pretty unrealistic and a massive time investment.

Also pets are kinda location bound at the moment until breeding is implemented.

It used to be extremely common and its even easier now your pets apparently log out with you. As someone that used 125 pets in the past I can guarantee you it will not be a niche gimmick situation it will be relatively commonplace especially if they reintroduce things like lykiators, pet receipts and house stables. Saying that they are gonna reintroduce necromancy so prepare yourself to be killed by lots of pets. I also thought they were planning on having mounted bears. lol

 

[Kaemik]

it covers quite a bit and UO economics was fine with the system in

But were UO pets as powerful as MO2 pets?

That's the thing. If MO2 pets were easier to acquire I think it would be insane to run any build that isn't pet capable. The only thing keeping them in a decent state of balance is that for the time invested in a single high-level pet you could kit like 30-50 mages and 1-10 fighters (The 1 being someone in full cronite)

 

[AssassinOTL]

But were UO pets as powerful as MO2 pets?

That's the thing. If MO2 pets were easier to acquire I think it would be insane to run any build that isn't pet capable. The only thing keeping them in a decent state of balance is that for the time invested in a single high-level pet you could kit like 30-50 mages and 1-10 fighters (The 1 being someone in full cronite)

You could Bond with Dragons, and it was just fine. Balance is fine, and it's a huge investment right now pets are in a shit place and you see them nowhere, it's not balanced it was nerfed into the ground by FF tears till the build didn't exist because the melee group cant Marco kill them

 

[Mowich]

I really liked the way UO did pets, it was nice having a trained up white wyrm.
You also needed vet over 80 to rez the bonded pet in UO.
Vet in MO2 is in a poor place… it takes too long to bandage, the cool down it crazy long - even at 100, and it bugs out when you are right next to the pet and it states “too far away”.

 

[2022]

I really liked the way UO did pets, it was nice having a trained up white wyrm.
You also needed vet over 80 to rez the bonded pet in UO.
Vet in MO2 is in a poor place… it takes too long to bandage, the cool down it crazy long - even at 100, and it bugs out when you are right next to the pet and it states “too far away”.

use magery, pots, dh food

there are many ways to heal it up quickly.

 

[bbihah]

I'd be for a overhaul and looking into things like the UO bonding mechanic in MO. IF the AI, especially pets, followed the game rules and limitations that a player has to. And once Beast mastery and beast influence are in, too.

This means, Attacks that are easier telegraphed and give ample enough time to block. Right now its a lot better than it used to be, with animals spamming out unblockable attacks at a rapid rate. Its better but not quite there yet. If pets could just like bandits feint attack, or otherwise do attacks that try to trick someone not paying attention to get a hit in or at least try, that'd be good too. The key here is that even an absolutely maxed pet with a max skilled tamer should still rely on the actual tamer doing things like micro on pet movement, attacks, retreat, attack AND do things on his own. The pet is an extension of the pet user, not an I WIN button.

What else? STAMINA, in some cases MANA(Ranged attacks from hunter lizards etc could have that as a resource). All AI, including pets should work exactly like players do. With walking, jogging and sprinting. Sprinting costing stamina, attacks costing stamina, blocking costing stamina and these being limiting factors to the AI's mobility, damage output and defensive capability.

Animals can't block, lots of animals should have "pet attacks" that are simply mobility related. Wolf doing a quick dash to try and avoid swings directed at it etc, things like that. Boars used to do a very MEH charge thing(Picks a target, charges towards it but doesnt steer so its easily sidestepped), but that was a sign of something cool to come, hope they build on things like that. Really haven't seen a boar do it recently, but i'm sure it still does.

Once AI and in turn pets have actual limitations to them that doesnt make them tireless W+M1 spamming murder machines, then they should look into actually making the life for people using them easier and maybe looking into something like a bonding mechanic as seen in UO.

But I wouldn't even bother with a discussion about it at this point further than this TBH, SV has other priorities right now and when they start giving AI some more work then, that discussion will be appropriately timed.

 

[AssassinOTL]

I'd be for a overhaul and looking into things like the UO bonding mechanic in MO. IF the AI, especially pets, followed the game rules and limitations that a player has to. And once Beast mastery and beast influence are in, too.

This means, Attacks that are easier telegraphed and give ample enough time to block. Right now its a lot better than it used to be, with animals spamming out unblockable attacks at a rapid rate. Its better but not quite there yet. If pets could just like bandits feint attack, or otherwise do attacks that try to trick someone not paying attention to get a hit in or at least try, that'd be good too. The key here is that even an absolutely maxed pet with a max skilled tamer should still rely on the actual tamer doing things like micro on pet movement, attacks, retreat, attack AND do things on his own. The pet is an extension of the pet user, not an I WIN button.

What else? STAMINA, in some cases MANA(Ranged attacks from hunter lizards etc could have that as a resource). All AI, including pets should work exactly like players do. With walking, jogging and sprinting. Sprinting costing stamina, attacks costing stamina, blocking costing stamina and these being limiting factors to the AI's mobility, damage output and defensive capability.

Animals can't block, lots of animals should have "pet attacks" that are simply mobility related. Wolf doing a quick dash to try and avoid swings directed at it etc, things like that. Boars used to do a very MEH charge thing(Picks a target, charges towards it but doesnt steer so its easily sidestepped), but that was a sign of something cool to come, hope they build on things like that. Really haven't seen a boar do it recently, but i'm sure it still does.

Once AI and in turn pets have actual limitations to them that doesnt make them tireless W+M1 spamming murder machines, then they should look into actually making the life for people using them easier and maybe looking into something like a bonding mechanic as seen in UO.

But I wouldn't even bother with a discussion about it at this point further than this TBH, SV has other priorities right now and when they start giving AI some more work then, that discussion will be appropriately timed.

That's a mute point honestly and i dont agree, those systems can come after, the stats will be higher than players, and you can always breed them to be higher, so it's pointless work, i've seen the endless loop of complaints from this point, no matter what systems are in there will be complaints and tears,

On the topic of not having an "i Win" button how about we take away the AHK for combat classes? so they dont just spam their "I Win" buttons in game and use the skill the game is designed to be based around? yeah i think that should be changed, and should have been changed before launch. but i dont think that will happen, opposing good design in the game is not a good take because you want it to be easier for the specialized build you have

 

[Kaemik]

I actually have 100 Adv. CC in the build of all my accounts. My concern is that with a bonding mechanic beastmasters will become meta and we'll get nerfed to the point of uselessness. I have 0 pro-FF bias.

I wouldn't mind seeing it if there was a complete overhaul of our role to require more skill and still be powerful. Eventually, I'd love to see taming require good skill usage through beast mastery to be effective and at that point, I could see making it A BIT easier to replace your pet. The revive/relevel would definitely still have to carry a decent cost though. Until they have time for that, I like that it's balanced by price rather than nerfed to uselessness. It's a role that can carry a fight but sets you back hours of work if your pet dies. That's not a horrible spot for now while they work on other systems.

 

[AssassinOTL]

I actually have 100 Adv. CC in the build of all my accounts. My concern is that with a bonding mechanic beastmasters will become meta and we'll get nerfed to the point of uselessness. I have 0 pro-FF bias.

I wouldn't mind seeing it if there was a complete overhaul of our role to require more skill and still be powerful. Eventually, I'd love to see taming require good skill usage through beast mastery to be effective and at that point, I could see making it A BIT easier to replace your pet. The revive/relevel would definitely still have to carry a decent cost though. Until they have time for that, I like that it's balanced by price rather than nerfed to uselessness. It's a role that can carry a fight but sets you back hours of work if your pet dies. That's not a horrible spot for now while they work on other systems.

Yeah they can make it lose levels on Revive to work with the systems that they have but remember its a small team they can get it in quick and build on the system as they go but to barr a good mechanic because they need to to a years worth of leg work would be sad to see they already have their hands full right now but i appreciate the constructive feedback and yeah we all want to see a lot of things but it will take time.