War Dev feedback- Risk vs reward, and consequence for saying no.

[PoisonArrows]

War Dec the idea is to declare war on the enemy, you get 30min prep, then they become red and then you can fight anywhere, (even in town) And that's all for the good news, and now the bad news.


No one accepts the damn things, or after you defeat them, they never go for round 2. (Koto, Old Guard, Goblins, IronWardens, NoMads, Wardens, MyrVikings, Legion, Integrity) Doesn't matter who it is, I Flat out challenged many of these guys, only a handful actually accepted. I met other guilds I wanted to fight, but they just let the War Dec sit there for days, and then they screenshot it and go type on help chat "LOL BeastMasters Canceled hahaha, we are so great! Lolll Loll laugh with us LOLLL, This must mean we are Superior to them guys!" It's so obnoxious. I'm not here to say which one of those guilds is better then the others, or to say who won or who lost. The videos we got on our youtube channels does that already, and Idc i just want more Pvp, but the current system doesn't allow for that to happen. Instead it lets the opponent just sit on your declaration of War with no consequence or further action required. They could sit on it forever if they wanted.


What I am here to say is really simple. War Dec doesn't do anything, because you have to sit there and wait for your opponent to accept your offer. If they don't accept then the offer will sit there forever. I feel like War should come with more serious accountability. If someone Declared War, you are at War, that's how War Works. Or if they don't want War, have them be Diplomatic and choose a option to appease the enemy forces. Give up 5% of your guilds combined Banks to be safe, put a 1 week timer before you can be chosen for War again, that way smaller guilds remain safe for a week and don't get bulied from the game. The Current system just lets the enemy sit on it. Certain Horse Killer guilds or the more cowardly guilds won't accept a War Dec at all.


Furthermore War comes with Pillaging of the enemy. Make it so if you win a War you get +10% of the enemies combined Bank as loot.

Lastly the current War System doesn't allow for any sort of victory, the players decide when the War ends by Canceling. I would love for there to be a system in place that Counts Kills of both sides and make it so War Can't be Canceled for at least 24 hours. And you can only hide in towns for 30min at a time. So After a 24 hour period ends they can go and end the war if they want, but the winner is decided by which side got the most kills on the enemy, rather then obnoxious attempts in help chat to inflate a broken Ego. This would help the game a ton! It would also reduce the size of Zerg guilds because players would have to be conscious on if they accept another 100 noobs into their ranks those noobs could get slaughtered in War. So there would be some balance there.



Summary: 1.) People can choose not to accept War, without consequence, but they should be forced to be diplomatic. Add a give enemy guild gold, items, whatever option in the diplomat option of Guild stone. 2.) Count Kills from Both sides, and make a War Last bare minimum 24 hours, with only 30 minutes town time at a time before enemy has to leave and go in wild again. After 24 hours either side can end the war and the side with most kills wins and gets 10% of enemy bank as a reward. 3.) War Cooldowns, after you fight in a War or be diplomatic you can't be chosen for a War for 1 week unless you choose to fight another one before your timer ends.

 

[ArcaneConsular]

Eh no one really wants the game to become rag man mode where small guilds of raggers just declare war on everyone and spend all day harassing them in towns. You say you want more rewards but you don't realize that bigger guilds get less from beating you and your five friends or whatever than they do

 

[LordMega]

War Dec the idea is to declare war on the enemy, you get 30min prep, then they become red and then you can fight anywhere, (even in town) And that's all for the good news, and now the bad news.

No one accepts the damn things, or after you defeat them, they never go for round 2. (Koto, Old Guard, Goblins, IronWardens, NoMads, Wardens, MyrVikings, Legion, Integrity) Doesn't matter who it is, I Flat out challenged many of these guys, only a handful actually accepted. I met other guilds I wanted to fight, but they just let the War Dec sit there for days, and then they screenshot it and go type on help chat "LOL BeastMasters Canceled hahaha, we are so great! Lolll Loll laugh with us LOLLL, This must mean we are Superior to them guys!" It's so obnoxious. I'm not here to say which one of those guilds is better then the others, or to say who won or who lost.

Yeah the War Dec system definitely needs some love- Viknuss wrote up a neat system that would address most or all of these issues. A non-consensual declaration needs to be in-game, because otherwise, what's the point? As many have pointed out, it works better as an alliance system than a war system.

That said, and this commentary being aside from 'fixing' or 'implementing' a better wardec system discussion, why would a large guild accept a war from a smaller rat guild? For example let's say your guild has 5-10 active players and you challenge a guild that has 20-50 active players. What is there for the large guild to gain here? Your 5-10 can hide in another city or logout, untag etc and wait for the opportunity to attack people who are AFK in town, or crafting, or doing some non-PvP activity etc. The large guild doesn't have a territory to siege down, they can't currently go find your house and burn it down. Either they have to take the initiative and move in an easily avoidable war party, or they just have to be on 'high alert' so that this small rat guild doesn't gank their crafters, record it and spout nonstop propaganda about a 'victory'. There's absolutely nothing to gain.

My personal opinion, I think you should have to own something to throw down a wardec. Like a medium house or maybe a stronghold. Otherwise you can just remake a guild with a new tag and throw down wardecs with your 5 members and act like you are the PvP Alphas simply because you can manage to inconvenience larger guilds and they have nothing to gain from having a war with you. The only real purpose, currently, is to wardec people who are allied to you, or want a 'friendly war' with probably some somewhat organized consensual pvp.

If you were required to have some sort of housing or property as a guild to declare war, that could also be a 'win condition' for the war. Your enemy has to destroy your stronghold, and you have to destroy their stronghold or keep. It would be nice for there to be a system in place to prevent a 500 member guild from declaring war on a 25 member guild- perhaps something like the tier system Viknuss described in his thread.

 

[PoisonArrows]

Eh no one really wants the game to become rag man mode where small guilds of raggers just declare war on everyone and spend all day harassing them in towns. You say you want more rewards but you don't realize that bigger guilds get less from beating you and your five friends or whatever than they do

The game is being marketed as a "Hardcore Full Loot Pvp game" emphasis on "Hardcore" And to be completely honest, tons of people want more from Tc and Wars and for these features to be massively more improved then they were in MO1. So they really need to add more to the War feature because right now it's as big of a let down as the Task System. On the Guild stone to declare War you have to go to the "Diplomat" Tab. And tbh there is no diplomatic options, just declare a war which down effectively nothing because no one ever accepts the War, and they aren't punished for not accepting. So it's basically a pointless feature. Why add it, if it can't even be used? What purpose does declaring War even do, if i can just skip that entire option and go for my opponents Keep or House instead. You see what i'm getting at here?

Also If they add a Cooldown of 1 week before you can challenge another guild and take another 10% of their stuff then I don't see how other smaller guilds will suffer. They either War like Men for the 10% or they give 5% to buy themselves a week of peace. Sounds Fair to me in a "Hardcore" game.

 

[PoisonArrows]

Yeah the War Dec system definitely needs some love- Viknuss wrote up a neat system that would address most or all of these issues. A non-consensual declaration needs to be in-game, because otherwise, what's the point? As many have pointed out, it works better as an alliance system than a war system.

That said, and this commentary being aside from 'fixing' or 'implementing' a better wardec system discussion, why would a large guild accept a war from a smaller rat guild? For example let's say your guild has 5-10 active players and you challenge a guild that has 20-50 active players. What is there for the large guild to gain here? Your 5-10 can hide in another city or logout, untag etc and wait for the opportunity to attack people who are AFK in town, or crafting, or doing some non-PvP activity etc. The large guild doesn't have a territory to siege down, they can't currently go find your house and burn it down. Either they have to take the initiative and move in an easily avoidable war party, or they just have to be on 'high alert' so that this small rat guild doesn't gank their crafters, record it and spout nonstop propaganda about a 'victory'. There's absolutely nothing to gain.

My personal opinion, I think you should have to own something to throw down a wardec. Like a medium house or maybe a stronghold. Otherwise you can just remake a guild with a new tag and throw down wardecs with your 5 members and act like you are the PvP Alphas simply because you can manage to inconvenience larger guilds and they have nothing to gain from having a war with you. The only real purpose, currently, is to wardec people who are allied to you, or want a 'friendly war' with probably some somewhat organized consensual pvp.

If you were required to have some sort of housing or property as a guild to declare war, that could also be a 'win condition' for the war. Your enemy has to destroy your stronghold, and you have to destroy their stronghold or keep. It would be nice for there to be a system in place to prevent a 500 member guild from declaring war on a 25 member guild- perhaps something like the tier system Viknuss described in his thread.

So I'll say this, you hit the nail on the head by saying there is no point to War Decs atm, because the enemy can just disappear or not accept exactly. I'll add onto this by saying, we can skip the War Dec and go straight for the enemy base whether it be a Keep or House or whatever they got. Which makes War Dec, which gives and offers nothing a pointless feature. And that is why your second point owning something in my opinion doesn't make much sense to me, because from my point of view that is why I currently feel War Dec is pointless cuz you can just go for the enemy building. However if enemy had to have a building before they could War Dec then that would certainly make War Decing make more sense. However I would actually Prefer them to use War Decing as something like my ideas where you can use War Dec to gain things from defeating your opponent rather then your idea of it simply being something that needs declared before enemy can be engaged. Furthermore if i wanted to get serious, why would I or anyone Declare my intentions, when I can plan it out with strategy to make our guys more successful? The Whole entire Declare War Dec sounds fun, but they implemented it incorrectly. If there is no consequence to the enemy then why am i wasting my time, when I can just charge head first for the enemy keep.

 

[Banespike]

The game is being marketed as a "Hardcore Full Loot Pvp game" emphasis on "Hardcore" And to be completely honest, tons of people want more from Tc and Wars and for these features to be massively more improved then they were in MO1. So they really need to add more to the War feature because right now it's as big of a let down as the Task System. On the Guild stone to declare War you have to go to the "Diplomat" Tab. And tbh there is no diplomatic options, just declare a war which down effectively nothing because no one ever accepts the War, and they aren't punished for not accepting. So it's basically a pointless feature. Why add it, if it can't even be used? What purpose does declaring War even do, if i can just skip that entire option and go for my opponents Keep or House instead. You see what i'm getting at here?

Also If they add a Cooldown of 1 week before you can challenge another guild and take another 10% of their stuff then I don't see how other smaller guilds will suffer. They either War like Men for the 10% or they give 5% to buy themselves a week of peace. Sounds Fair to me in a "Hardcore" game.

pvp guilds will grief the shit out of pve / trader guilds, that’s it. Everyone will have a pve account and a pvp account with almost nothing in the bank then. Not a good idea for the normal gamer. Won’t help the game to grow.
If you want stuff from pve guilds, pk them and gain your negative reputation.
Just my 2 cents